just want to make my lack of voice be heard
I glanced through these mostly hilarious comments, and I wondered to myself, What would Nasira think of all this? would it bother her?
Then I realized, she wouldnt even bother reading this childish shit. I am a self proclaimed friend of hers. what other kind of friend is there? As a friend..I feel inclined to defend her. but then again, she really doesnt need any defense from you lot of pre pubescant children.
Hi Arawn, you sexy bitch!
How about... this log? :)
So do we have any logs where Nasira does something unbecomming, or is this just general dislike?
The only problem I've ever had with her was when her moral alt claimed storm bow for SoU.
Depends on which reputation you're going on, I suppose, Dalkar.
Toram, I will.
I don't know the lass -at all-. Haven't interacted icly or oocly with Nasira, but reputation precedes. She's one level above most people over here due to the fact that she doesn't cuss, whine, flame or otherwise show immaturity in any way. And that's to be respected. Yes, her playing style may have this effect and that effect on the mud, but she's just one player. The 'sheep' effect comes to mind.
I see no reason to be attacking her on an OOC level, but I guess it'd be fair to rip her ICly all you want. These comment pages are OOC... aren't they?
Chewie's got a Dr. Phil thing going on. I can almost hear the twang.
I'm yet to see anyone defend Nasira who isnt a self-proclaimed friend of hers.
Well i like what was told about the point of view, becouse all the changes that were done altough i don`t really like them at this point when it comes to me playing the game, DO make the game very close to the world created in the books. Noone trusts a strange couse he can be a killer, worke for ERs and take to to a trap etc. etc.. So saying the game sucks becosue it ain`t what you remember is like well listening to youre parents saying damn that song is great and for you it`s some shit. The game at the start was diferent becosue you were younger and looked at it a bit diferent and now when you look back at what it used to be you remember how fine it was ONLY becouse you were younger. Well it`s my opinion you don`t have to feel the same.
On another note cursing at Nasira as a typist is stupid and childish.
A Someone threatened me the other day. It was pretty hilarious. BUT I WILL NOT BE SILENCED
FIGHT THE POWER
I have more respect for nasiras typist as a char player than anyother player i can think of.
Her moral FR was good, and IC, here SOU FR was good and IC, even with nasira, when I do talk to her, she is pleasent,as she was in the previouce lives i knew her as. But as any ER should be, is ruthless. Again, IC, imo.
Don't see any problems with her myself.
Hahaha, we're all so bored and pissed off at the world:P
I'm gonna have to call you on a few points. Modern newbs have it easy--extraordinarily easy--compared to when most of us started. Their trouble only begins when they cross into the contestable lands, which is a good deal better than being picked off relatively often at any level above four by bored assassins.
Melkor's 'vision' was at least as viable as Aule's and was directly counter to many of the recent harmful changes. On the other hand, it's debatable that ANY plan which existed more than a couple of years ago would allow for... THIS. In any case declaring loyalty to any one game plan is rash. If anyone cares to debate this, talk to me in the MUD.
Is there neglect? Yes. It isn't really toward any one element of the game, though. It's in the removal of existing elements without a well-conceived and tested replacement ready, or with the installation of an overwrought, topheavy stopgap that has a large blinking 'BANGFRIENDLY' sign attached. Those of us who don't spend most of our time PKing or preparing to PK--the majority of the playerbase, might I remind you--are left in the lurch. E.g.: 'Sure, we'll remove Valinor oversight of theme, but won't allow any other form of theme review to exist. It may cheapen Arda as a whole, but who cares?' That, of course, instructs weak-willed players that they should disregard theme, and instead turn their attention to banging level 10s. So here we are.
This used to be a pk mud. Now its a land of faggots presided over by retarded children who refuse to admit they've taken a great game that required skill and imagination and ruined it with their 'balancing' and oft times broken fixes. In the last 2-3 years before I quit for good (because of King Faggot) the horrendous neglect of the incoming playerbase by ainur compounded by rampant slaughter of newbies by bastards on both sides of the war discouraged people from meeting anyone but allies on their own side. This caused people to cross the line from friendly competition that sometimes got a little out of hand to outright hatred and war. This bastardization of Aule's vision out to be a crime and if it was in my power I would certainly hold the people responsible for ruining the fantasy retreat of 100's by sentencing them to hundreds of hours of quake and halo. Actually, given what they turned arda into, they probably have done that to themself. By removing the skill, innovation and daring from pk as well as corrupting the social community of arda through their rediculous promotion of gangbangs they have thoroughly ground out what was once an enjoyable pasttime.
PS: Pounder is still the fricking coolest guy in arda
It doesn't have to be PK-based, in fact probably the least harmful way is when it is PK based. He was probably pointing out that it was one of Sicarius' friends that is known of running campaigns attempting to ruin the game for someone because of their RL or so, that's what I'd call a real griefer.
Really I dont think that labelling someone a griefer is that of a strong accusation. Everyone is an active griefer, more or less willingly. What actually matters is the scale and range of grief caused. The more power you have and the more people follow your steps, the more harm you are doomed to commit. This doesn't mean you can't be a 'positive' member of the community at the same time.
What do you mean outside perspective, ainur grief people all the time.
Griefers are pretty common in online communities, certainly games.
I think thats a pretty strong accusation to level against someone, though, even if you dislike their play style. While its not rare to meet one, they generally aren't 'leaders' of more than a small gang, they don't spawn out of nowhere, and you usually don't see someone be a positive member of the community and 'just become' a griefer 'one day'.
Whats interesting to me is that from an outside perspective (we don't die, or pkill, or lose equipment, etc), some people here accusing others of griefers are throwing stones from glass houses - some of the people they /always/ associate with could be EASILY labelled griefers by the rest of the community.
Which, I think, just goes to show that its a matter of perspective.
Evil is often a matter of where you stand, pointing your indicting finger.
Now I'm just waiting for Paraiko to chime in with his comments about Zogs.
There are two things which I believe deserved to be add to what has been said so far. Imo both opinions are valid in their ways.
However Dorf, you when you say
'I figure you get three options: leave, stay and whine, or adapt.'
I disagree here, there ia fourth one to me that is: to stick up for what you believe or what you want to play.
In fact, everyone keeps blaming the ainur for what the game has become, but they are not the only one to blame. We, the playerbase, are half to blame for this downfall. They are the ones who have brought the new rules, 'we' (for the most part) are the one who have agreed on playing those new rules.
In that sense, if you don't like gangbang, don't gangbang. If you don't like the way pvp interaction is limited, don't contribute in its limitation.
In that sense, Nasira, however a great roleplayer she is, is more than most responsible for this lack of interactive scale and for what the game has become, because she has more power and influence than most.
Which is also the reason why she generates that much ressent, this is also a ressent she brought upon her shoulders by the way she acts, which I'm sure she is aware of anyhow.
However when I hear people trash talk her on ooc issues, this is pathetic, but hey to each their own way to be griefers I guess.
To sum up, yes the ainur are responsible for the flaws of this game, many changes always lead to such. And yes, Nasira, those who follow her and those who play the same game as hers yet complain about the game, are as much responsible.
If you don't like the rules, resist.
I need to clarify one thing, and it will probably be my last comment on this log.
I'm not railing against the current system (and by extension of that, Nasira et al.) because of some huge chip on my own shoulder about dying to ERs. I've not died to them very much at all. I think I've only died as a highlevel (across all of my characters) two or three times since the introduction of new ERs.
I have sucked it up, and I have stuck around. However, I've been around for a long time. I know where most things are, I've kept up with the changes, and I usually know what I'm doing.
The less experienced people do not have that luxury, and the incentive to learn and to get better has also been diminished. It is much harder to explore. Failkill has fixed some of these problems while at the same time creating others. It (usually) makes it easier to walk around without fear of getting picked off, but it makes bangs more important. Whether or not the tradeoff has been worth it is another matter entirely, and could certainly spawn another 80 comments. Double that if Formid starts chiming in.
The simple fact remains that there are less people who want to stick around under the current system. The people who are PK-horny have always been a rather small minority of overall players. Now the system has been tilted in that direction without regard for the checks and balances that held the game together for years.
People are leaving, and they always have been. But they aren't being replaced quickly enough. Certainly, the ER system is not the only thing responsible for this; there are many other factors at play. It's certainly one of the biggest factors, though.
Also, I'm not sure where I really went after Olga the typist. Maybe if she still had a character who wasn't a douchebag still I wouldn't be saying any of this. That not being the case, I only have one frame of reference by which to judge her, and from my perspective, it isn't good. You say she doesn't get off on making other people miserable. Why then, does she do what she does? She does make people miserable, and she's an absolute idiot if she doesn't know that. I judge people by their actions, and any capital she had with me is long gone because of the way she plays now.
Yeah. It's just a game. That doesn't mean that people aren't invested in it emotionally (for better or worse, and usually the latter).
Oh, and regarding Deboraha's comment on the Swedes. They were nuked for what they did. I say that their behavior was bad not only because of the lawsys abuse but also because picking off noobs for sport is not good for the game. Nasira is not abusing any bugs (to my knowledge), but that does not make her any less of a griefer.
This ended up being a lot longer than what I wanted to write in the first place. I'm done with this discussion.
Good one Dorf, and Deb.
I thought I was done with this game on multiple occasions, but have kept coming back for one reason or another. I don't ever play any other computer or video games, just this. I think if anyone is sick of the game, they should probably explore another aspect of it, like try out ERs, or give Valinor a shot. I am personally not and have never been that interested in the PK atmosphere, which is why I always have merciful on. Believe me, it is still fun even without being able to string an ear onto my necklace, and sometimes, making someone lose their gold and a unique or semi unique due to merciful hurts more than if they had died.
Now that was well said.
I feel like I had a good chunk to say about a few things, but I guess I don't after Deb's post. I think she covered anything I'd want to say about Nasira. She definitely uses the system Valinor has created to her advantage and helped turn the ERs from mewling snagas into the forces of Sauron... since she IS so consistent and she DOESN'T trash talk, that makes it difficult for me NOT to respect her.
But concerning this being an 'irreversibly PK MUD' and all that tripe, I'll just say what I've said before:
It's more than possible to keep exploring, especially these months. When this first started to become an issue, the map was red more often than not... now it stays relatively balanced, and complete takeovers are rare.
If you're cautious and intelligent, you can get away with exploring almost anywhere. After a death or two, I learned how to explore Mordor solo. With a little help from Redjack & Co., Moria's a piece of cake. I took the time to learn Erebor and all of its newer features. All of the newbie-Ainu quests I've seen in the recent past have been well-coded and well-described, and are worth seeing. Heck, I explore Harondor and beyond even when they're taken over, thanks to the time I was willing to put in learning the waterways of Arda.
I'm hardly the most talented player around. But I'm adaptable.
I figure you get three options: leave, stay and whine, or adapt. I prefer the third; I get to keep playing the way I like to, and I don't feel like I'm headbutting a brick wall by complaining about everything and talking about how 'everything's been going down the drain for the last five years.'
Well Deb is 100%correct the game changed a long time ago and you must live with it. Just do what many old players did Leave it. It is not a place which you remember from highschool nor it is a special mud like it used to be for many who after licking T2T stoped playing any outher text based game.
It`s time to do what the people in book done, it`s time to swim towards to west couse the world is changing and there is no more place for magic in it.
Make a long break keep in youre memoris the old T2T and log in again and start playing, and then you`ll see how much the game changed, and you`ll leave it for the 'new generation' :D.
Man oh man, I would have loved for you to have played back when Fjant and Freddie were truly active, Sicarius. They would go on sprees with those chars, or more often lvl 12-15 alts, and kill EVERYONE within the vicinity of Bree, Bywater, Grey Havens and Michel Delving. Then they would use a lawsys bug to avoid paying any fines and laughed their asses off. Oh and I know this because Freddie is a good friend of mine in the for real world and we've talked about old mud stories and tricks from back in the day. You would be leading the lynch mob on them ready to 'BURN THE SOCIOPATHIC SWEEEEEEEEEEEDESSSSSSSSSS!!!'
Now there is one unbelievably OMG HUCKING FUGE difference between what Fjant and Freddie did back in the day and what Nasira does now: they abused a bug(s) but Nasira is only doing what the game has been coded for her to do. Ranting about Nasira is pointless when this is the game as it was coded to be. You were in Valinor recently enough to know what was being coded. I don't see why you are outraged at her over the effect as though this was some huge, unexpected shock.
Now, I will say one thing about your assertion that Nasira's typist is a bad person because of what she does in pk on the game, get off it. I've known her as a player and friend for 8, nearly 9, years now and never have I seen nor heard of her, in or out of the game, ever seeking to purposely hurt someone emotionally, for harassment, or otherwise. The same can't be said of many on that game, including you and me. She treats this as a game. Of course the game has, through the coding efforts of Valinor, become the 'text-based Quake' that the older playerbase and administration argued and worked so much to prevent. So she plays it like that. Bang bang, you're dead.
I know people who are much worse than Nasira on T2T, people who thrive on giving genuine emotional hurt in the game and as much personal harm as possible. Some of them are your good friends. She plays a game as a game the way it was coded. She logs on, does her thing, logs off.
T2T used to be a much better, richer game and a place where people just had fun and did silly things, along with the gear gathering, pking and such. It stopped being that a long time ago, way before there was ever a Nasira.
If you don't like what you see there, quit. It's that simple. But don't try to demonize Nasira's typist. She's a better person than most.
It's a game after all. Log on, do your thing, log off or just log off and be happy with whichever.
I think someone stole Formid's account on logomania and it posting for him!
Yeah dude, i completely agree with you this time...
Yeah, I actually agree with Formid here.
Good point, Formid, I think the bastard child comment summed it up nicely.
[new] Date: 16. May, 2006, 17:25:44 By: Rekthorne
This is a PK MUD now, end of story. Hence why the game is losing players who don't enjoy PK.
Wrong, it became a PK mud when the new ER's were first released, now it's the bastard child of a PK Mud and a non PK Mud. The only way to PK now is to take a huge party into enemy lands and slaughter everyone. There is no way (for ERvFR or FRvER) for a solo player to go out and kill another solo (or hell even a party). Thats why the mud is losing both PKers and non PKers.
Maybe funny isn't the right word for it.
Its funny how they pretty much took mordor away, then did a 180 and made the whole game just like it.
I guess at the end of the day, it's about the game type it has become. Once upon a time you could go exploring. Now you can be confined to a small area of the grid for as long as it takes for enough of your side to get on and retake battlepoints. Once upon a time you could go exploring places you didn't know without certain people seeing 'WARNING WARNING FREE KILL AND FREE EQUIPMENT IN THIS PLACE, KILL KILL KILL'.
When I came back and started leveling, a couple of times I asked people to get me a simple, totaly unusual and very common sailors cutlass, only to get the response 'Oh, sorry I can't do that, too many ERs on.' I can't understand how anyone could possibly think that is a good thing.
You're right Nyx, if you don't like the shithole of a game this place has become, best to just quit playing it. It's not going to get better.
You can go on and on about her dedication to RP and civility, but the fact is she has irreparably damaged the MUD, so those qualities aren't much comfort to the old and new players thoroughly turned off by the ER playstyle she was fundamental in shaping.
Shit happens. Lowbie FR's get killed, lowbie ER's get killed. If you can't handle it, quit. Otherwise, get over it. In any case, stop the godawful whining.
<<I am not scapegoating Nasira, merely pointing to her as a prime example of the worst sort of person T2T has to offer.>>
Bullshit. I can think of many other types of people who would qualify as the 'worst sort of person' on T2T -- MPers who cheat and cannot character separate at all *cough Exide*; Riot ERs, who create characters *specifically* to kill ER newbies and lowbies -- just to name a couple. I've partied with Nasira maybe 20 times on raids (possibly more), and I can think of 5 times where she hunted off when she realized it was a lowbie that she reflexively started hunting.
And, as it's been pointed out before, not only ERs gangbang lowbies.
<<Some people will say that 'oh, it's just that she's just so IC all the time'... well if the role you wish to play is a socipathic bitch, then it stands to reason that people will treat you like one and will call you on it.>>
So, she picks a role, sticks to it, and you're attacking her (the typist) for it? If you think to argue that statement, keep in mind that you're calling her the 'worst type of person on T2T'. If she's playing a 'socipath', then that's her style. Who are you to call someone out for playing a specific type of role? Who's the judge that says which type of character's RP is 'better' than someone elses? I don't know Nasira very well personally, but I will say this: I can't think of anytime she's ever been out of character. I'm sure she talks to friends about RL stuff in tells, but that's it so far as I can tell. She stays in character 100% of the time. I'd say that her dedication to RP makes her one of the better people in this game.
<<You can get away with a lot more on T2T than real life in terms of how you can treat others. And don't get me wrong, I've certainly screwed some people over during my time here, but it is not the primary thing that I do, and I don't think anyone would say that I'm an opportunist who is taking full advantage of the latitude and anonymity granted by an internet game.>>
I don't know you at all, so I can't really address most of that paragraph. I will say this: in the limited interactions I've had with her in tells, she's never been anything but helpful, and certainly not demeaning in any way. I think she treats people in game the way her character, a grizzled legion Warlord, would treat other people: you've got to earn her respect, not the other way around.
<And yes, she doesn't trash talk, that's true. I would probably hate her even more if she did, but as it is her actions speak loudly enough.>.
Another salient point about her: she doesn't talk shit at all.
I don't know what happened between you and her in the past (like you mentioned earlier), but this post practically screams that you're holding a major grudge. Whatever it is, I'm sure it's silly (it's a text-based game, after all...) and probably not worth losing a good friend over. Do what you will, but I suggest if there's a chance to rekindle some old friendship, perhaps you should take it. If she truly was as good of a friend as you claimed, then there are few things you shouldn't be able to work out, especially after years have passed.
Anyways, I'm done with my armchair therapy session. Let the flaming recommence. :P
This whole shit has created and aspect of bitterness between players. The ainur have accomplished one mission. They've made us hate ERs, and made ERs hate us. Well done.
Now if you can make it fun to play again...
I am not scapegoating Nasira, merely pointing to her as a prime example of the worst sort of person T2T has to offer.
Some people will say that 'oh, it's just that she's just so IC all the time'... well if the role you wish to play is a socipathic bitch, then it stands to reason that people will treat you like one and will call you on it.
You can get away with a lot more on T2T than real life in terms of how you can treat others. And don't get me wrong, I've certainly screwed some people over during my time here, but it is not the primary thing that I do, and I don't think anyone would say that I'm an opportunist who is taking full advantage of the latitude and anonymity granted by an internet game.
Few would defend Nasira in that respect.
And yes, she doesn't trash talk, that's true. I would probably hate her even more if she did, but as it is her actions speak loudly enough.
And MY point wasn't entirely about banging either - just that people can't always know in the heat of the moment whether someone in contested territory (here, AT A FREAKING ENEMY-HELD BATTLEPOINT) is actually a low-level. This isn't like anyone went out of there way to hunt a lowbie down. That has happened, but this isn't a log of that.
Well, everyone needs a scapegoat, I guess.
There are so many things one could argue are wrong with the way things are, and so many people who have left bad impressions of themselves, that I think it's taken to a level of ridiculousness when people are always talking about Nasira being the driving force. It's silly. Yeah, she PKs, bang and solo (I've fought her both ways, it does happen). I will say that at least she isn't talking shit all over the comms about it, unlike many of the people who post here and take the time to complain about one ER who's just an awful person for ruining the game for everyone.
At least Nasira isn't the type of player to promise loyalty on Tuesday and try to kill you on Wednesday. [Inside Joke]
Total users: 94
Not bad I'd say..
I agree about Nasira. The same goes with several other people. It's why the active number of newbies has been dropping, leading to an overall drop off in activity. Theres no player of tomorrow without newbies today. Just the same old guys who eventually get too busy to play any more. There's no possible way for the MUD to go back to its active days, but we gotta squeeze what we can out of it, while we have the time.
Also, consider that this is coming from someone who used to consider her a friend, and she considered me one also.
She was a nice person when she was Oli. What we're left with now is perhaps one of the most pathetic excuses for a player, though. I know I'm not alone when I think she and those like her are ruining this game. If anyone deserved to lose priceless posessions (like the rings she lost), it's her.
This is a PK MUD now, end of story. Hence why the game is losing players who don't enjoy PK.
Dorf the issue isn't banging, it's people killing helpless low levels just because they can, I've done it a few times, but the difference here is that the low levels killed have no right to reimbursements. If I do something arseholish to a low level, then Im a bastard, but I have to pay for it. Now people can solo, 5 man or hell 50 man a level 5 newbie and not have to pay for it. I don't think that's a good insentive for new people to want to play this game. We don't want a bunch of Spartans running around. I guess it's just human nature that if someone can get away with doing something wrong then they will do something wrong
By: Arawn Remove
It's sad to see Nasira do something like this, I'm told it's not unusual either. Not the person I knew, that's for sure.
I keep hearing comments like this, am I the only person who thought she was this much of a piece of shit a few years ago too?
When I was level 12 killing Ugly Orcs in Mirkwood (before it was SOR), a 5-man led by Nasira came in and dropped me in three rounds. I don't really care about the death, but that's just kinda pathetic.
I made an assassin for non PvP purposes once years back. I was killed at level 4, again at level 5, then at level 9, and again at level 12. Killing low levels is nothing new.
Ainur: 'Do not go to east Arda if you cannot dodge a Gangbang'
Always sucks to see it happen, but there aren't exactly 'well-known newbies,' really. Nasira doesn't play as much as she used to, and can't be expected to learn everyone's names, or be leading a war party and 'do legend maybenewb, help title.whatthehellisaslayeranyway.'
Of course, this is me talking and not her, but after seeing the hell bang action always is from both sides, I just know that I wouldn't want to be LEADING one and trying to worry about level.
It's hazardous out there. Frigging check warscape once in a while. Took Nasira about three of my ears before I learned to do it, and that was stupidly slow.
Level 8 has what like 120hp?
I said 'an ER' as in singular. Sometimes its two. Yes a few times there wasn't time and the level 8 dies, but a lot of times we leave the room and he runs off.
Correct me, but a lvl 8 will last two rounds on a 5 men party. Without them doing special attacks.
Oftentimes a level 8 or so enters the room during a raid and an ER attacks on instinct. Nasira leads the party away and the newbie runs off safely. Probably guessed he was higher level seeing as he was in Gondor
It's sad to see Nasira do something like this, I'm told it's not unusual either. Not the person I knew, that's for sure.
Maybe they didn't bother to check what level you were, but whatever. Its not like I haven't seen level 10 ERs 5 man banged in a contested Harondor.
I saw them do it to a level 6 guy back when they could double ambush at the bp at any time. This is kind of different cause the bp was being contended though.
Cry a fucking river for me, please.