Pounder
Well, I'm a bit sad to see pounder go. As one of the few who remembers Pounder when he first started playing, I have to comment on how dedicated and honest he was at the begining of his time here. It could have been Mother Teresa was his typist, he was so positive and helpful. Then after he left, as Scatha mentioned, he changed..Mother Teresa was replaced by Mel Gibson in Braveheart, someone who could enjoy killing people, but somehow also seemed honest and good. Now , as we all see, he's turned into Mel Gibson drunk at 5 in the morning pulled off on the side of the road shouting at the top of his lungs. So, just be glad he's decided to quit now...he couldnt handle this place cause i think he cared for it too much.
I made this big ass essay or how the hell you spell it, but my conclution of 100 lines was, you all suck, have a nice day, please come again
or he might actually work at work. god forbid! :p haha best wishes to you, Pounder.
Manni wrote:
'Pounder goes out and gets laid instead of MUDding this weekend.'
Well i dont think we need to worry about that happening. I bet he is just going to sit in a corner for 8 hours a day, wondering how to fill his time.
I'm like 99.6 percent sure this grand plan of thoughts, novellas, dissertations, epic poetry, and modern ascii art will crash and burn approximately 7 minutes after Pounder goes out and gets laid instead of MUDding this weekend.
All hail the Dalai Pounder.
You people shall soon see an outstanding treat in terms of logs and writings. Through out the many years I have been apart of the towers I have collected some extraordinary thoughts by others and especially things I have thought to myself. Whether people read them matters not, they can choose to see where a different person and how a different person approaches the mud. What a mad twist of irony when one of my biggest supporters is someone I used to not be able to stand because we were always competing and we disagreed on some levels. I will stop on that and many other things because it will turn into a book. People may copy some of which I say into their philosophy papers which would only honor me. Anyways, the most I will say at the moment is, I have found an incredible incredible peace suddenly. Its amazing, beyond anything most of you could problably ever understand (I am not saying any of you are stupid just generally younger, this is something out of experience and has little to do with how smart one is). Look for things especially my personal notes to start showing up on Sunday or early next week. It will slowly lead to more concrete things such as logs that really define me as Pounder, really give you a glimpse into the daily life and maybe give you some ideas of stupid things you can try. And end in accomplishments that I was very proud of and enjoyed very much. Much will be misunderstood or not understood at all because alas, no two people in arda used to think alike.
Now that I've actually read the log and the comments... I have nothing to add.
RL is better than games anyway.
Thanks for the love, Bakal. And I'm really glad I am not nor was not PoL.
'Do these two cancel one another out? -- I determined that they did. Given that, would some level 10 8hour character be deleted for what he did? Yes. And so he was.'
So you determined they cancelled eachother out...then threw that out and took it as if you were nuking somebody who had never put anything into the MUD? Right.
Draugluin wrote:
'On the other hand, you are more than welcome to disagree with the decision, or simply be saddened by it.'
Oh, thank you for allowing us to disagree and be saddened by your act.
'I feel compelled to tell you facts when...'
I didn't see any facts, where did you lay them?
'Take it or leave it, please.'
No comment.
Erm, ok, I am new here, I didn't know Pounder personally.
But from what I see in this discussion is that nuking him surprised and angried most of the players.
Then I read Scatha and Draugluin explaining their decision. And it, too, like the comments before, looks just fine...
So : what is wrong here??
Maybe Pounder deserved to be nuked, maybe he didn't. I, however, find the WAY he was nuked wrong.
What lacks in this mud is publicity. IF people knew he was doing what the Ainur say he had been doing for the past 12 months or so, and IF they knew he had so many warnings, well maybe they wouldn't be that surprised and claiming the nuke so terribly wrong?
Nuking over 300 days of age , and a popular player too, without somehow preparing the 'audience' for that would inevitably cause such uproar.
Still, I would never PK a lvl 22. Nor nuke 355 days of age.
Pounders legendinfo lists a punishment reason, and its not fluff or misdirection. Its /incredibly/ accurate, without creating a log of what was said. Of course, Fofester, he wasn't deleted for disagreeing with me. He's done that tons of times, called me tons of names, and lived another day. As he knows quite well, this is a case of him going too far...then WAY too far...and running out of leeway.
Quite honestly, our (our) decision came down to this: Yes, he's very old, done lots of good, and is very popular. Yes, he has quite the recent history of many warnings and other punishments. Do these two cancel one another out? -- I determined that they did. Given that, would some level 10 8hour character be deleted for what he did? Yes.
And so, he was.
Pounder knows all of this.
OF COURSE he does not agree with his deletion, but since he is not INSANE he will also not agree with the idea that 'nothing' happened, or that this was the first incident.
I feel this tug of war between how much to interject into your outrage. On the one hand, there's a large amount of just incredibly false statements being tossed around (like Fofester noticed) by people who don't know anything. On the other hand, you are more than welcome to disagree with the decision, or simply be saddened by it.
I don't mind what you think about the whole episode when its said and done, but, I feel compelled to tell you facts when I see page after page of 'guess'. Take it or leave it, please.
So remember kids, stay on the parade route if you don't want the Mussolinur to feel nostalgic about when you used to show up for Triumph of the Will screenings on time.
Pounder, you did a lot of good stuff, I thought you were the bees knees when I was a newbie and still remember being there when you hibernated the first time (just after breaking bywater bar's room with too many beers). Then somewhere inbetween leaving and coming back, something flipped and well, we ended up with the opinion of each other that we have right now :-p
To be honest, it doesn't surprise me that Pounder's been nuked. I'm in fact surprised it took this long - it's a testament to Draugluin's patience that it has. All you people who think it just happened because of the circumstances immediately preceding the nuke, have it wrong. For the past 12 months+, I've both witnessed and been victim of, countless ranting attacks. It's been exhausting and frankly undeserved.
I don't expect any of you to like, take this in, since most of you seem to be 100% behind him, but thin ice has been skated on for a LONG time. To the point where I actually had a conversation with him sometime in the last 6 months, where I actually just asked him why he has to be so fucking abrasive. It didn't have any effect (obviously).
I'm as guilty as the next when it comes to being harsh and abrasive, but well, I know my limits and try to rein myself back in when it's getting out of hand. I think it was just all-out war in Pounder's mind.
You'll obviously be missed by a lot of people. The OLD Pounder is someone I'll miss (and have missed).
Dormin, poke Wally for me. :P I'm also one of those zillion WoW players.
I don't think there's much point in boycotting the battle thingy. It won't make any difference, and you'll just be missing out on what has the potential to be one of the more entertaining things to happen on the MUD lately.
Its interesting how this new RP battle was announced immediately after an uproar against the ainur started...Oh wait...its not interesting at all.
They should've made Manni PoL...
'With that kind of power comes responsibility, just nuking because someone critizied your choices or bugs in a system, yet didn't break any rules wouldn't be right.'
Do any of you people complaining that he was nuked for no good reason actually know for certain that he did nothing but criticize? His nuke info seems to suggest otherwise. I'm not taking a side either way because I don't know the whole story, I'm just wondering whether you guys are getting all pissed based on the assumption that he didn't break any 'rules', without actually knowing what he did. I have no idea what happened prior to Pounder's nuking, so I really am just wondering.
It is definitely sad to see Pounder go, especially like that. Good luck to you, Pounder.
Hi.
Well, I was nuked too. For making an admittedly inappropriate, but nevertheless amusing, comment. Given that I only had one warning, and no long term history of rulebreaking, it's the kind of thing which would usually have resulted in a warning, or a comm ban. But I've evidently quite the knack for timing. What amuses me most is that the comment I made wasn't 'Anti-Valinor' per se, but was in fact satirizing those players who were making a big deal out of Pounder's nuke and painting him as some kind of martyr.
I'm not as bothered as I should be. Partly because I don't care about the MUD anymore, and partly because Esker is but one of a veritable fleet of characters, unlike Pounder who channeled all of his time and energy here into a single character. Incidentally, If I could start my time here again, I think that's what I'd do. In any case, my nuke is largely inconsequential, and no loss to the MUD.
But Pounder's is different. Whereas I spent most of the last two years idling and cynically deriding the administration, Pounder never gave up helping newbies or trying to improve this place for the better. The circumstances of his nuke, fair or unfair, do not concern me. All I know is that I've lost a friend, and this game has lost an institution. Good luck with everything in the future, mate.
-Esker, Supervillain of the Rimbor-Anim!
Yes, be a mindless zombie!
IF I had the power to nuke anyone and everyone who ever pissed me off, there wouldn't be too many people left in the mud >:)
With that kind of power comes responsibility, just nuking because someone critizied your choices or bugs in a system, yet didn't break any rules wouldn't be right.
Also, like people have said, if everyone immorts to code then we wouldn't have a player-base. Secondly, there are people that should code, and those that shouldn't. But to get mad because someone critized your coding (someone who doesn't code) is no reason to nuke them.
Side bar:
I just love how programmers lately have some kinda god complex that you shouldn't critize their work. And if you do, your just too stupid to understand what they went through to make it, or the process that the software is going through. *Fists* Beta my arse!
Gaul is boring.
You're missing the fact that the MUD isn't a democratic society. And it isn't supposed to be one.
Well Bakal, it does happen in some countries.
Am I the only one who laughs at Khelban's comments? :P
'Hi, I'm Khelban. I'm going to compare drunk driving in real life to criticizing something on a text based game. I'm gay.'
Nuking someone on the mud is like the equivalent of the death penalty in real life. Imagine if someone was put to death for criticizing our government. There goes the Constitution. Khelban, Captain Douche of Arda, second only to Draugluin, you suck at life.
People, we're forgetting something very important. If any mortal witnesses the Nirnaeth Arnoediad, WE CAN'T MAKE PLEDGE DRIVE JOKES ANYMORE. That truly will inspire unnumbered tears. For the sake of the comm, boycott the event.
Why doesn't everyone just not log on for a week :P
Or do the Ghandi thing, sit at Bree SP and fast for a month.
Nirnaeth Arnoediad > Pounder
I would never boycott it.
BOYCOTT NIRNAETH ARNOEDIAD!
Let's see how valinor will react when a thing they put a lot of effort into is in vain. Like they did with Pounder
the guards are 6 feet 10 - all of them!
Dark is the day when your nuked for being critical of a system that isn't working!
Estraven, that'd depend on how big the guards are and whether or not people saw the end of that movie.
if it wasn't a text game i can imagine the rulers of this world coming to bree signpost with a squad of mighty guards and asking who is pounder who have dared so much lately.. and a crowd of people would stand up and claim they're pounder - first one by one then in a multitude of voices!
Please give him another shot! I am sure Pounder cares about Arda and his heart is set on making it better.
Hie
Boycott the events.
Bring Back Pounder, Bring Back Esker!
kthx bie
Changes to the game need to happen. I usually take changes in stride and try to adapt. Most of my enjoyment from this game has come from interaction with other players and not the mechanics of the mud anyways. After saying all of that it is so damn frustrating to see old friends leave and never return. And it pisses me off to hear about these pointless nukes. Pounder has contributed to this mud time and time again and I am sure he would of continued to better the game. Nuking is great for those players who continually suck the life out of Arda, it is another matter all together to wipe out a character who has had so much history, blood, sweat, and time invested into this place.
Core's right. Writing a petition of complaints and posting it here for people to 'sign' on comments will probably be more of use than endless arguments.
'What is new is that we are making Powers do somethign they don't want to do.'
You get somebody's back up, and you're going to do more harm than good. If any good can even come of it. Let Pounder and Draugluin work it all out, if that's what either wants to do.
Well i was nuked at 9/11. I didn't think it was a fair nuke, but Melkor got pissed and reach for the Gun. I talked for him for about 2hours. Thoose 2 hours melkor spent the time trash talking me and twisting everyword i said and refused to belive any word i said, he then wanted me to lie to say something i didn't mean. But in the end i was reinstated. I think the reason i was reinstated was because Melkor had abit of time to cool down and look at it one more time and maybe thought it was abit harsh. I don't know didn't get much out of the conversation with him and he never admitted that he thought i was right. so im not sure why i was reinstated, but i talked to him and presented my thoughts about it and he twisted it. So what do we learn from this? Instead of gathering the hole mudding community to go on a rampart against the ainus (i think this will make things worse because then ainu's will see it as a challenge and wont budge down) i think the best thing pounder could do i cool down abit and take the conversation with the ainu that did the nuking. If he gets no where that way then sure the mudding community can go on a rampart. But i still think this is betwen the ainu and pounder to try and solve first.
You're missing the point.
Can anyone write the letter I was talking about? Then maybe while sending it to Draugluin we can forward it to everybody who is online so they sign themselves below our names and send to Draugluin.
Let's see the schedule: two weeks for the letter campaign, one week to wait for change and if there is no result on the 12th of October, I am suiciding.
I suggest you start commenting on what we can do instead of 'Bitching'. The discussion that was carried out in these 40 posts is not new. What is new is that we are making Powers do somethign they don't want to do.
*takes off his hat for Pounder*
Valinor made the mob angry now.
And year by year,we are losing activity :( its so bad so see 20-30 onlines,i remember the days we reached 1000+ auction number at alexa and 100+ onlines...Why to nuke people,kick out of mud? We are so little here...
Ainur didn't nuke a person,they nuked a history like Pounder,who is one of the last one in game.Pounder is a great guy,i found the chance to meet him 2 months ago.It is so sad to meet you that late Pounder but you are a great guy,funny and stubborn :P.I will never forget our conversations.
*Farts on Pounder*
I will miss you...
Wtf, you cannot nuke Pounder just like that, he's an awesome guy!
Don't forget about me beornis!
This game......I log on from time to time to see if battlepoints have been done away with and fade has been returned, and low and behold Pounder has been nuked. This mud takes itself way too seriously. It is and will continue to be it's undoing.
Pounder nuked? I've been gone to long :(. I'm playing WoW with Kazin, Melkor, and Wally :0 if you wanna come there. T2T died a little each time ER's were implemented and the reason many of the older players quit playing. I don't really wanna argue with this because i think without change you stay stagnant. But, I think sometimes change can be bad and in this case I think it was the bad.
I hope the ainur think long and hard about this nuke. Although, I know as long as Draugluin's in charge nothing will get done. I also don't think just replacing his character can undo the damage that was done. Pounder's played for years as a playtester, newbiehelper, and just a fun guy on the mud. Yu aren't just nuking Pounder but probably a majority of the people that still give 2cents about the mud and play because of him. He's been one of my best friends and a great player. It's not really his loss so much as Arda's.
Dormin
Yeah, but then again World of Warcraft has taken the souls of millions.
I think all of us have been nuked/ have friends nuked. Then how 'friendly' is this MUD? That's a serious reason why people leave. How can 90% of the users be mistaken? Something's seriously wrong here.
Most of us spent a large part of their lives here. Ruining 355 days of age is like...murder. I bet Draugluin is soon going to get as many nukes as I have PKills..if he hasn't already beaten me.
I've lived under a communist regime, people had more freedom.
It's sad to see this world ruined like that. We used to have an average of 100 people online a few years back...
FIGHT THE POWER
<rant>
Thanks Kalmah. Well said.
There's been longstanding ainur lords, OLs (even a power, if I'm not mistaken) that contributed very much to the mud, did some stupid things and got themselves nuked. They put a lot of time (getting to Power is no easy or short task) and work into this game and ruined it for themselves. Real life would do the same.
30 years as a teacher putting a lot into a school system, you have illicit relations with a kid and you're gone. Doesn't matter that you had 30 years and could retire in a few. You blew it for yourself. Get caught driving drunk underage? Doesn't matter that you were a straight-A student, you now can never get an education certificate. Its life, deal with it.
Insults aren't critical. Insults do nothing but show you don't care at all what is being done. You rationalize, you compromise, you lay down a proper argument. That's how you bring about change. Actually use the opportunities presented (votes and forums), you'll actually get something done.
Getting into unprovoked hissy-fits doesn't help anyone. If you can't learn to sit down and argue like a normal human being you don't deserve to be here. Don't deserve to be anywhere with rational beings for that matter. (This is purely generalized mind you.)
As a sidenote to Nyx: Mortals should not even have known about that. But in essence we conveyed our thoughts, presented arguments, and worked out a compromise. All is fine now.
</rant>
After you are in Valinor for awhile, you could start to lose touch with the mortal world and forget what it is like. People have different playing styles. If you have them immorting, they will create things that would seem fun/exciting/good to them, which could not be fun to other people. Sure, you will always have this. There is always arguments. Nothing can change that. But when you have so many people complaining about about the current state of the MUD, people from all different playing styles, something is certainly wrong. I'm not saying I am perfect, Valinor is perfect, or the mortal population is perfect, but Valinor is not for everyone.
But what do i know, i only play this game.
Havn't read all the comments. I'll do that later on when I'm not as tired as i am now. I'd just like to make a comment about the whole idea about ' start coding for the game and give something back ' thing, and the ainurs are volunteer workers (although i might be slightly off topic). I honestly don't see the big deal in that, they started (aside from the creators) playing this game just like the rest of us, they chose to immort why? not because they felt like they were doing some great fucking service to us, no because they thought it was fun. You're not gandhi just because you code for a text based game. And hey, I would imagine alot of administrators for other MUDs would agree with me when I say it's more fun coding and making shit for a game that has alot of users, and especially users that doesn't think you're a douche.
Take care Pounder, you were always a great friend. I'll continue to tell the llama story in your memory.
For the people who say this game is 100% free, yes, but just remember that there are some who donate to help it out. At least, I assume there are some...I've donated a few dollars to try and help.
Second...at my job and other places I've seen, people tend to be upset with leaders when they are unapproachable. I get that feeling here as well. Seems like if Valinor were more approachable and easy to talk to, the bitching and whining would not happen as much (although there are still going to be those certain types of players).
I have played for just over two years, but I tend to try and never piss off any of the Ainur mostly because of the random nukes I've seen happen. I don't think it should be like that. I have one character, it's the only one I plan on ever having, and if I lost all the time I've put into it, I'd just never come back.
I used to run a sports website and do some writing, covering the local pro teams. It was amazing to see how the readers FLOCKED to our website because we interacted with them, while the official newspapers in town ignored their readers and succeeded in pissing them all off normally.
I have no idea what Pounder said to cause this, maybe under the rules it was totally warranted. But this game is about the players just as much as its about the coders, and the relationship betweeen the two should be better.
I mean geez...the game is NOTHING without the players...and pissing them off doesn't make any sense to me. There should be monthly meetings between the players and the Ainur, an open forum to talk about the game, the direction it is going in and what would be best to keep it strong.
Anyways...just some thoughts from me. I respected Pounder because of how long he played and how he stuck to his guns on certain things. I find it very, very sad, that it would come down to him being nuked after all the time he put into this place.
If people were just calm and rational, this stuff would never have to happen.
*shrugs*
There isn't any self-righteous attitude going on in anyone's comments... simple logical statements. I too hope that the people who cannot cope and who bring down the overall attitude/amusement of the MUD for the general playerbase fade away long before those who really care about it and make the most of it do.
Arahon: Your projection of the MUD's future along the lines of my previous comment is completely bogus. People from all playing styles and statures of credibility could immort, and that would provide a greater experience for everyone involved. A more hands on approach to changing things, a closer dynamic between Valinor and Arda strengthened by the fact that the new blood still remembers what the mortal way of life is like...
There are other concrete ways to evoke changes in the MUD, and one of the easiest is an attitude adjustment and a little adaptation. Having an open mind and discarding prejudice/bias towards other people/groups really helps anyone's case, especially if you're essaying to bring about a positive shift in the MUD's direction.
You take one or two popular players who know what they're doing, have them immort, and then you have two ainur who know what the players want. Doesn't seem so hard.
*Tips his hat to Pounder*
Sure, the ainur have gave us all a game to play, but the ones that started it and did the best job of it are now gone or near gone. Without them, they couldn't fix the bugs and such, but when you go so long without playing the game that mortals do, you don't see things the same way the mortals do. Their ideas of what is best isn't always best. It is just a shame that if you argue with that, you are looked down upon or if you speak up against it too harshly, you can get punished for it.
That whole 'You want to make a difference, change your Rank: from Bitch to Maia.' statement wouldn't go, either. If everyone that has a problem with the MUD's current state and all the problems with it immorted, the mortals would be left with killers and newbies, and eventually just fade away if they were turned off by the idea of kill or be killed.
So long Pounder. I didn't know you personally, but I know that you stood up for newbies and tried to make it more fun for them, and that is what this MUD needs more of.
Yes the ainu do a good job for us, and have created something that is down right awsome for free labor.
But let's not forget, without people critizing the work, nothing will change... If you do not have a critical eye, you won't be even motivated to change something.
Shame to see people get nuked, and Pounder was a good guy.
But if your nuked because you had a critical eye, and weren't afraid to tell someone that the system is messed up. Then that's totally wrong, no matter if they 'hurt' your feelings in telling you that something you worked hard to create isn't good.
Fair enough comment Pounder. Hope you find some better place to go to anyway.
Take your self righteous bullshit and shove it up your ass, dude.
Yes, Valinor has never done anything for the MUD, just coded the whole damn game and gave 10 years of free entertainment. Without change, players would be bored and gone by now anyways, or they seriously need to leave their house if they haven't lost interest by then. Obviously everyone can never be pleased. Some people will like certain changes, others will hate them. Fixes are in place and things will change, but if you're still bitter and whiny.. just leave? and Camillus no, character age shouldn't mean shit when putting out punishments. Just because someone has spent 50d on a character or whatever doesn't mean they get to go spreekill or multiplay or shit and not receive punishment. I've been here over 6 years, been through a lot of changes and hated some, but had fun, and have yet to get a warning or nuke. Its really not that hard.
*tips his hat to Pounder.* Enjoy, whatever you do. :p
Pounder, I think you forget that most ERs had FRs first. There isn't some magical change to one's thinking when they make an ER. It always sucks to see an old player go, whether nuked or not.
I just had a super game of quake 3 just now. It was just like the towers but i could respawn and keep killing shit and there was tons of blood and guts!:) Yeah i have to agree with camillus already. I am done being a accident watcher:)
I haven't been around for a while and obviously don't know the nuke story, but even though this is 'just' a game, some people still put a lot of time into it, like Pounder. He may have as much or more invested in the game than Draugluin does, who knows, but knowing how much time the person spends on a single character should be looked at when doling out punishments.
I used to love spending time playing this game, used to set my alarm clock at odd hours just to make sure our guild armoury wouldn't reset. But like many, my desire to play has been whittled to nothing.
I tried to keep an interest. I made new characters, tried different types of roleplay, even tried my hand at coding and being an immortal two times (unsuccessfully) so that I could help make changes that might keep the enjoyment for me. Nothing worked, so I stopped playing. If you want changes that arn't going to happen, or if you just arn't having a good time, you should think about quitting. You almost always won't regret it.
Maybe that year range on the end of my comment is a bit overrated. Who knows with various games being created how long the towers will actually last.
No, i was not told ever to stop, no i was not online at the time of my nuking draugluin figured it would be better for me that way.
Right.... NO I NEVER directly insulted mathias before the guild-bann or AFTER. If they want to make an inference I never made, then thats their issue as ainur have often inferred insults indirectly to players in fact Mathias did the exact thing to me before the guildbann. Oh, and to point out how much a problem they are having with this issue... how is it that MAGICALLY... the last battle for the fundraiser gets announced the DAY AFTER the nuke? Please :P Its not coincedence, they don't know how to deal with things correctly, remember fail kill fixes and other things? This is why they really needed player input from the start but they refused it almost always until things become a major problem. I don't need to write shit to people, I have been on as a level 1 some of the day saying my goodbyes to people I have always respected if not liked alot. If you missed me too bad, you can talk to kelemir or elk but they will never give out my email nor will I really respond to much of any requests:P Since (I guess some optimists could say if) I won't be reinstated, look for some decent logs of the times. Also I will post the log most of you want to see. I couldn't care less, it will be very juicy and fun to read. I will also post the 3 man on shelob, various other fun or interesting things just to give you an idea of what Pounder was about, a history so to speak. And yeah, i am hotheaded generally, i don't put up well with being looked down upon especially by people who are in 'a higher position', I treat nearly everyone as an equal as much shit as i give them. Even my enemies like Amearn and all, I didn't really hate you, I hated a system that was making all my friends leave the mud. Yes you were using it but you didn't create it. Everyone IMHO was needed but some people and you can guess who, do not ever deserve respect because they will NEVER give you it. Keep that in mind. Don't believe me thats fine. Choose your own destiny. I am going to look into the game trempk mentioned below, my guess is they actually listen to the crowds who play their game because they realize the crowd is just as important as their own coders, and they pay way more careful attention to things that might be making people leave their game. Keep all these wierd circumstances in mind. If you think at all that you are important to the mud as a player, this is completely false. You can be kicked from a guild for any reason, nuked anytime (this is all in their rules btw) and many other things. Its all up to who is mad at you or dislikes you. I got on their bad side because I saw midlevels and soloists get massacred and leave and I couldn't sit back and watch, I made KoTN to try to fight that and it sort of worked as we did ok along with several individuals and bkd with protecting them to a point. Yeah so I am blunt i get mad at shit when things aren't right and its because watching a disregard for players pissed me off. Trust me, ainur are jumping for joy the second i got nuked, they can pretend they aren't but as per comms like scatha's 'good riddence SP?' proves otherwise, ER's are probalbly as well (even though they will be more bored from now on because they will have a little less resistance unless they just want free kills who would ever think that?). And well, as mad as I should be from the results of this, it definately wasn't unexpected, the times of aule and melkor guiding the mud through creation and not forms of destruction are gone. And with that the time of Pounder is gone. Good luck to all, with the exception of a few people (players as well) who could easily be argued as most of the reason for the degrade of most of everything. I have last all but 1 of my original batch of friends from the old times anyways. And aside from Josi everyone i knew IRL has quit the game too. You now have a future with ravathirs, amearn's, nasira's and draugluins and mathias's to look forward too. If you love/like them your golden and set for the next 3-5 years.
Peace,
Pounder.
Haha, I love it when people talk about 'The Rules' when shit like this happens. You can't really apply the rules to situations like this considering how sometimes what Pounder said wouldn't have been a big deal and other times when it gets you nuked. I've expierienced this shit far too many times. Call a certain player a whore on the comm one day and no ones cares! Do it again the next and you're dust in the wind. Clowns.
You know, if a single line of code was never written after the year 1998 or so, I'd still be play the game the same as it was then. Also, if you think about it, are Ainur really even necessary to this games' survival? I'm pretty sure the playerbase can handle it's own affairs. Probably make things a whole helluva lot funner too. Meh.
Core, you're taking this too far. This is a game here, and rules remain rules. Rules would be pointless if people like Pounder could just get away with anything because of their old age and 'status'. Pounder was as aware as all of us of what can happen. ;)
And shit yeah, quit playing if it brings tears to your eyes. :P
With Nyx and Tire on this.
As Nyx said though, what is there to do? Nothing more than what Pounder did, he finally made a strong stand for what he believed and he didn't shut up after Draug or the other power told him to stop. But what are we to them? We'll always be the 'whiners who don't give anything back to the game'.
Storm Bow was Castamir's. :P
You know, when I look at Draugluin, sometimes I think he's done a lot of good for this game. Then again, sometimes I think he just coded a bunch of shit no one asked for and defended a bunch of people who didn't need defending. He probably should've retired after Aiglos and Storm Bow, best thing he ever did.
-Bakal!
Save Esker! (Pounder too)
I'm in.
Where's my protest log?
Why don't you all just quit playing? Can you really live without it? I mean, the game has sucked for a while now, the top admin can be a real douchebag, you could probably get nuked for sending him a tell if you caught him on the wrong day. Whats the point of playing? Just wait until LotR online comes out and then all go buy that. This sort of thing happens all the time with this game, its not going to stop. Whether its Rauko, Culfinglin, Mathias, Draugluin, whoever, there's always going to be somebody who knows that he can pretty much do whatever he wants and will do it. Once Draugluin gives it up, someone else will take his place. He'll be cool for a while just like Draugluin was, until it goes to his head and he starts nuking people for bullshit. Then people will complain about what he does too.
Berzelius wrote:
>You want to make a difference, change your Rank: from Bitch to Maia.
This is called a civil stand. Citizens, in this case players, must have a say about what is happening in the world they live in. They don't need to become magistrates to make a difference. They are the difference. And the ruling body is supposed to listen to them.
>There are rules.
Yes, there are. But every rule has an exception.
>no one's legendary status/advanced age/affable personality can mitigate punishable charges.
I haven't heard the charges. That's because noone has made the facts public. And since we don't have access to them, it's just your words that they are 'punishable'. Just words. Usually empty.
You're missing my point. If enough people in Arda want Pounder to be alive, he'll be ressurected.
>its not as if its completely shut off from the players' input
It is not, of course. It can't be. It exists because of the players. That's why we have A SAY and that's why Pounder is going to get reinstated.
>Hopefully this incident can expand the liasons between mortals and immortals.
It's for the good of the community.
I actually wish I could stay and follow this thread for a few hours, even though I already know how it'll end. Some ainur or ainur alts will show up and start going on about how we have no right to insult them because they volunteer their time here to 'make Arda better'. Think about this. When you're coding crap that everyone suffers from, or noone ever bothers using, you are not making Arda a better place. But we still can't point out to you that sometimes you do make useless things?
You know what this reminds me of? The domains in Valinor being removed, and all Ainur being in disgust and outrage, as a result of weighed voting a power and a vala's votes overrode everyone else's. Or something along those lines.. if not that, it's very close. So what happened? Valinor protested and complained publicly, on the main comm, etc etc. Everyone conforms. Eventually. (Correct me if I'm wrong and the domains were restored? I don't follow such events anymore.) I really like Tire's 1984 analogy, it's very, very much the same here. I can relate to Pounder in this case, as I used to do what he did - publicly show how some things Valinor implements are useless, stupid, noone uses them, etc, except I was always trying to be polite and not say straightout something sucks, but rather explain why it's not a good idea. Hence I wasn't nuked! Hurray? Not really. I was eventually driven off in other ways. I guess I didn't care as much as Pounder about this whole bullshit so I snapped and walked away.. voluntarily. Kudos to Pounder for sticking up to the end. People who have the guts to be honest and say what they really think are very very few, and... get shot in the face for it. I can't say I wouldn't see it coming, but I'm still speechless.
You might like to know:
I denied the petition for the exact reason I commented there, and I didn't touch any comments. Even if its fun to pretend otherwise or class it as a 'silencing'. :)
You can feel free to direct your complaints to me about something regarding law (or, anything, as I double as PoA) via mail, tell, or 'law' (the command).
Cya!
Immort and actually give back to the MUD instead of playing it/taking it for granted that its a free service, and then you can talk shit about ainur. Sure, everyone has been hit heavy by unfounded changes etc, but this isn't some sort of utopian world, there will always be unhappy changes etc. You want to make a difference, change your Rank: from Bitch to Maia.
To Tire, Core, & Co. -> Sure express your thoughts on the matter, but don't blindly join the mob and make blanket statements and threats. There are rules. You break them, there are punishments. Perhaps you escape reality for a reason, because you cannot grasp this simple action/reaction relationship that governs similar situations IRL?
It is a great loss to the MUDding community to have Pounder nuked, but no one's legendary status/advanced age/affable personality can mitigate punishable charges.
There are methods for the general playerbase's opinions to trickle into Valinor, its not as if its completely shut off from the players' input... however, of course there is obvious room for improvement. Hopefully this incident can expand the liasons between mortals and immortals.
Draugluin rejected the petition and removed mine and Tire's comments.
I hope this attempt to silence us does not stop the campaign.
I suggest somebody writes a well-organised letter to Draugluin and posts it on the logpage so we all can copy/paste mail it to D.
If more people agree to suicide eventually, that's be great too. A good idea is to think of deadline for the reinstation. If noone comments on that, I'm gonna continue writing.
~Core
_
Stupid ainur.
Approved