It's the syphilis. It's eating holes in his brain :P
I guess I forgot that Tireless lost his fucking mind about a week ago and now he just spits out garbled words.
...
Primrose tea imprints a farce upon your humorous. Revile treasured pretensions.
Christ, do you just spam your garbage carebear shit on every log? Seriously, Tireless. Maybe you don't have the balls to ban Smoky, but you can at least get rid of this trash.
noobs & hatespeak down the drain. SAVE THE MUD! http://winnetoux.blogspot.com/2010/06/so-much-hate.html
Draimon is officially been determined to not be a retard:
[new] Date: 08. Jun, 2010, 20:06:51 By: Draimon
yeah im not gonna do that
yeah im not gonna do that
hey draimon logon to chat
http://winnetoux.blogspot.com/
woric and draimon had some relly cool logs. everybody else sucks big time though so don't read their shit.
Anyways, since i haven't really read any logs for at least 3 years, aside from some random occassion; If someone wants to point out which chars are worth loglisting, or any specific logs to read then that someone would be doing me a favour. - It's offtopic i know but the forum on this site ain't used by none -
Is winnetou finally learning how to troll?? :) How cute.
Don't be so modest Sunflash!
Winnetou is has-been. He's on a different level of bitter from a never-was like me.
Who is Winnetou?
Who is Angrald?
Ash was a grand newbie. The noobiest of the bunch. Same for Pounder - just a sidekick to nothing.
Anyways, why does this log have 130 commenets?:P
Logan likes little boys.
I think Armand did something similar to KV before the Glorglas incident. Not sure though.
I agree with sunflash.
Lets hate Angrald some more.
I think he already has
Hmm, only if you manage to steal his hair ;)
Oh Grozin! I'm so sorry about that! I'll swing by Oprah one of the next few days and tell her how bad I have been and that i have changed my ways.
Then after that will you go on the Dr. Phill show with me? :-)
I hated Ash. He stole my aiglos at auction and still owes me 1k *grrr*.
stands for quantus faggus maximus. everybody knows that shit
Shabba, It's not that much of discussion its just talking about the past and peoples views on it. :)
Haha, I started doing it because Sarys started doing it. He said it felt right.
In hindsight, perhaps it is an acronym...
I suppose it's easy to mistakenly think of a short random letter name like that as an acronym. I gave in and read all the comments and I fail to see the point of this huge discussion.
Not really on topic but why do you type Qfm in caps?
Semantics. Of the characters who were responsible for Polk's overthrow, I know that at least two were typists associated with the guild in question. Were my knowledge of alternate characters as comprehensive as that of you and your associates, then I have little doubt that I'd be aware of a few more. Those typists stood to benefit.
Additionally, when asked by Polk what would become of Glorglas you replied that it would be 'eventually returned more or less the same', or words to that effect. To me, this indicates your intention to return to your place of origin after the whole affair was through. Regardless of what guild Ash was or wasn't in at that particular moment, I think it was fairly clear to all involved where your affiliations lay. I don't wish to dredge up the past further, though, so I guess we'll have to agree to disagree. Time and not-giving-a-shit anymore have given me a fresh perspective on the whole affair, and I'm happy to give credit where it's due. As I said before, you made the game a hell of a lot more interesting.
On face value you could blame Polk. Or you could blame QFM and myself for leaving him in charge and green-lighting 'whatever it took the keep the guild alive.' Honestly, though, I blame the administration and their ridiculous guild policies of the time. Had we not been under pressure to keep in line with stringent activity restrictions amidst a declining playerbase, then the leadership of the time might not have felt it necessary to relax admission requirements and admit people into the guild whom we might not have done under ordinary circumstances. Another one to chalk up to the Draugluin era, I guess.
It seems I am going to get drawn into a topic I normal do not discuss about guilds. But I feel that I should point out something about multiplying. It's very true that I started a transfer for a tiny million gold coins to cover some expenses. However I disagree about this touching multiplying for me as no other characters of mine would benefit from this then the one I did the transfer with.
I had no characters in the guild being transfered to. Was doing the transfer with my main character.
Of course people in Valinor disagress, but if the final word is not guilty, it must mean not guilty. No matter how much was disgussed about it.
And for fuck's sake stop arguing with Draimon and claiming he's nobody etc. Both of you are probably just trolling man, at least squeeze in something witty or funny in your posts and don't make em too long please either, it's weak, and clownlike. Not that i reckon any of you give a shit what i say though. Natural born assholes.
Looking back at it, taking over Glorglas was a real feat, something that you hadn't seen in the game before and my hat goes off to Ash. I was of a different oppinion at the time. Probably just worried they'd do the same to my guild though honestly..
-I ain't no goddamn son of a bitch
If you say so, Sunflash. I would have thought that someone as vitriolic and embittered against Valinor as you would realize that what they say and what they do are merely two sides of the same coin. I was specifically told by the administration at the time that the balance transfer was a significant factor in their decision to reverse what happened. I haven't been as pedantic at saving correspondence as Westar, unfortunately, so I don't have anything to copy and paste. I know what I was told, though, and I've also noticed that Westar hasn't chosen to deny it. QFM might have saved something, but sadly he's inactive at the moment. I think anybody with more sense than a goat can see that a balance transfer under those circumstances would constitute MP; regardless of whatever wishy-washy mails Valinor sent out.
owned
But there is no rulebreaking! :-)
04/10/07 13:07: Comment by the Valar:
This is a game.
As a game, we want to make things as much fun as possible for
as many people as possible.
Yeah, it was fun seeing you take over Glorglas. It was also
fun seeing what came of it.
But in the long run, more players will have more fun if Glorglas
is headed by a person who specifically wants Glorglas to succeed.
Therefore, Valinor has interfered and put Polk back into
the Glorglas GMship.
----
You and your fellow conspirators broke no rules and there will be no
action taken against you.
Style is a subjective thing, though, and I don't think it should be an influence on the way in which rulebreaking is interpreted.
The difference is Etrius, Ash did it with style always. I can't say that much for the durms whatsoever. Period.
Lost, lost! Alas, forsooth, gone 'ere the prarie gardens fated to burn lost their scaly immutability! Forever lies arise in demonic eyes reprise, see the scary in faithless dominion!
Just for the record, I think a lot of Ash as a typist. Love him or hate him, he brought a lot to this game. And he brought it in a different way. I'm not so bitter or so jaded that I can't appreciate what he brought to this place. Even if I didn't always like him, which I didn't, he certainly made my experience here more interesting.
Oh thats right. I spreekill, cheat, and I am generally an asshole. I forget.
because you are an embodiment of every reason why nobody plays this game anymore
Why am I suddenly being brought up?
haha. look at draimon, still pretending like he's somebody :p *pet*
Or drop dead.
This Angrald clown needs to grow some balls.
but hey im sure colven or someone will tell me thats untrue
according to nogothrim the way to truly beat the game is to be nuked for harassing your enemies
Draimon has a pretty good point. I think he was the first level 22 with 23 stats as Westar, definitely the oldest character on the mud when he suicided, and then managed to control two guilds at once as Ash. He's about as close to beating the game as you can get.
This is a MUD not a Mush...
wrong as usual from the newbie douglas. the character ash beat the game basically. props to him.
Hatred? Not quite. I shout down from my moral pedestal on a regular basis because it makes me feel high and mighty. I don't agree with jerkoffs such as yourself taking something that others enjoy and find entertaining and turning it into a place where you can get satisfaction from someone else's undeserved misery. But I can appreciate that you think you can bully people in a game and do things that would otherwise get the shit beat out of you in real life. However, being a game doesn't give you the right to fuck people over just because it amuses you. Your right to amuse yourself ends at the point where you ruin the game for someone else.
I donât really think there is much of a comparison between Glorglas and Durmanhoth. As I see it then it really is two very different happenings, even both where very much amusing and fun. But then, I do sorta live to feed on all the drama. The taking of Glorglas was not for no reason at all, it was as revenge from an action done by Polk their guildmaster before the takeover, but thatâs all in the past now.
I do think it was a shame that Durmanhoth was removed, Having just delt with the cheaters and let the guild live as well as it could with those who wasn't cheaters would have been best. But then I might just be a bit of sentimental as it was my guild in the past.
Douglas, I donât know why you have so much hatred build up, but sure is amusing. :-)
Ash was a tool. Of the thieves guild members I'm aware of and have had dealings with first hand, only one of them has not been a total douche bag. It's one thing to RP a thief/assassin and play a little dirty in game. It's quite another to take someone else's years of work and flush it down the damn toilet when they've done nothing, just because you can. To those of you that find that kind of bullshit amusing, I hope you rot in hell. Grow the fuck up.
Again, the same people are not making associations between the two ways that things were done in two very very different circumstances. There were definitely good people still left in Durms, and those people as such have moved onto other guilds. There was nothing wrong with this. But if you are that ignorant to believe there wasn't widespread cheating in there, the fact that several instances of this cheating/abuse hit the log pages and the community general knowledge only give the odds to a substantial amount of cheating that was never caught/given public attention.
Etrius, the issue isn't really your credibility per say, but rather what maybe I guess people consider you to be missing in your evaluations. If say I made a guild up, and the guild became super popular due to letting everyone in and having fun but also cheated significantly to attain power and fund its operations, is that fair to the remainder of the people not in the guild? Absolutely not. Also, there is no truly valid comparison between the Glorglas take over and reversal and the Durm/GB torching etc. They were done in very different intents, and even in the eye of law, intent judges harshness of punishment (at least typically). Ash's takeover was obviously not free of malice (at least in result), but it was done just to see more if he could do it using the constructs in the game, rather than cheating itself. The money wire was more of anything had to do with seeing if he could do it and get away with it. It's hard to explain, but Ash was a strange but very valuable peice of the mud IMHO. I cannot say that for several of the players that were in durms and were involved with the other peice (especially delkin). I mean really, consider reactions to getting nuked/removed. Did I go around and spill people's alt information or mud code when I got nuked? No. I just left (although later I was drawn in again by TNT and did things at the advice and help of some of the admin there). Did I make another alt just to come on and spreekill and powerplay again? No. It's long, but like Etrius, I love writting shitload long paragraphs. :)
I doubt QB rent is that high.
Drew's mom got ape flunked when Zardoz flipped the grackle perch, zoologically unsound. Tin tuna is worse than its organic companion.
btw in case you didn't know, QB got 1 mill of the gold from durm vaults when it got disbanded to make up for the takeover, which sort of crosses the line between reversing wrongs, and giving a retarded guild enough gold to exist for another year for no reason.
You could say that, Norin. I campaigned extensively to the admin for a restoration of the Glorglas' original leadership. I did this whilst knowing full well that we were essentially in the wrong, and that we had lost control of the organization due to sheer negligence and inefficient management. What swung the argument in my favor was something which I wasn't even aware of at the time; the fact Ash had initiated a balance transfer of one million gold to his 'main' guild. This was tantamount to using alts to gain control of one guild for the benefit of another character's, a situation which ran curiously parallel to the situations which later involved the Durmanhoth. Although there was no bug abuse, as you say, there was definitely a degree of MP involved; which both I and the administration felt was adequate justification for a reversal.
Yep, Yoana, you were not on the list of people they wanted to share it with. Sad.
Allso the QB deal was blended in with some abuse (especially concerning a way to prevent the loyal QB members overthrow the ursuping GM) that was deemed to be illegal.
The Glorglas takeover deal was not done with cheating\abuse as far as i know (as Lobo points out too), and still got reversed by Valinor. Guess that it was against some kind of 'Spirit of the Mud' thing too?
I wasn't offered mud code until after the removal, *shrug*.
Perhaps the difference was the manner of the takeover, since it was bug abuse, but still, the vast majority of durms weren't cheating, so meh.
Glorglas incident was similar in its results, but not in its means.
Yoana, point 2 is completely false. i was there too.
There have been copies of the MUD code floating around for years. My presumption is that most copies originated from the Castamir schism, although there was at least one doing the rounds before then. I was offered one a long time before the Durmanhoth returned, and I'm sure a lot of other longterm players were as well. As for 'actively spreading it around the guild', I was never offered one on my Durm. That could be neither here nor there, though, as I'm often 'out of the loop' even in guilds I'm supposed to be running. Mute's decision to spread the code post-nuke was condemned by a majority of formers members including Manni himself.
The Durmanhoth did indeed have their hall removed for what happened with the Quickblades. Oddly enough, a similar offense was perpetuated on the Glorglas sometime earlier by another guild. Yet as far as I'm aware, they received no such stringent punishment. A large amount of justice is dependent upon the current administration and their own attitude and personal beliefs.
two comments, as an ex-durm, and a bad egg.
1) after the qb stuff was found out, I and Haylie were punished harshly on the offending chars (she got a nuke, Aisyah got a perma guildban + some other stuff), and both our mains got temp guildbans..(mine was 2wks, hers may have been 6, i forget).
After that incident, durms as a whole was told to knock the shit off, and I don't know of any new cheating that occured, excluding like delkin evading his ban, etc.
Durms was removed < 2 weeks after the qb thing, since i still had my ban.
2) I was in durms, and mud code was not tossed around at all until we were removed.
There were some bad seeds in Durmanhoth and Valinor destroyed the guild to prevent them from taking root. It didn't help the ex-guildmembers' case when the players that cost them their hall came back and threw a temper tantrum passing out the code to get even.
Didn't Durmanhoth just get their hall back after being banned from it for that bit with the Quickblades throwaways? They were acting in unison then and it's too bad they ruined it for the legit members of their guild. But a guild that condones cheating is going to be labeled as a cheater guild.
Also I understand that the durms 'released' the code publicly after the guild was removed, but if you want to claim that it wasn't already being used within the guild, your credibility is already far less than dubious.
Acting against the spirit of the MUD may be a vague line, but I don't think it takes a genius to know that actively spreading the MUD code within a guild is on the wrong side of that.
To have opinions which you can't back up or argue for...I call that faith :P Helloooooooo religion.
Etrius. Why have you turned against us so?
It was Jakar wasn't it. I will spank him if you want me too
Nah, I like making long posts. It's sadder, in my opinion, to have opinions which you can't back up or argue for.
It's sad that it got to the point of you feeling like you have to defend your opinions. You don't owe these people anything.
I'm sorry to make such a long post, but to be honest I'm a bit bored. I opted out of an evening of drinking because I have an early start tomorrow, but now I can't get to sleep anyway. Oh well.
Despite the implications to the contrary within this thread, my association with the Durmanhoth has often been turbulent. As GM of RoI and a high ranking member of several moral guilds, I was partly responsible for forging the coalition which opposed the ER friendly Durmanhoth of the Nildnab era. As well as fighting them in that particular war, I was also heavily involved in conflicts against them on another two characters. It's true that I did have a character there sometime later, but that was mostly due to a friendship with Manni; I was active in neither politics nor playerkilling. I wholeheartedly reject the assertion that I am 'in bed' with any single group of players. I have always experimented with different characters and playing styles, and have an eclectic set of MUD friends due to that fact.
I also reject the assertion that rule-breaking was a point of theme. I don't have the exact figures to hand, but the Durmanhoth memberlist was thirty plus at various points. The cheating was perpetuated by a minority within the guild; just as the former cheaters in FRA, Beornings and BkD constitute a minority within their respective guilds. I don't advocate the wholesale removal of those guilds.
I don't see how any sane person can't grasp that removing a guild and nuking the leadership for 'crimes against the spirit of the mud' sets a bad, bad precedent. Even those of you who rejoiced because it was your enemies on the receiving end this time must surely grasp how arbitrary and ridiculous a punishment it is. Who decides what 'the spirit of the MUD' is? Where is it written down? What constitutes an infringement? One day it might be you or your friends in the firing line, and I daresay you'll be a little more vocal.
The Durmanhoth brought a lot to the game, and made it more interesting. I'm someone that fought against them on and off for almost a decade on a plethora of characters, but I have enough perspective to realize the role they played here. I'm sorry if that drains whatever was left of my dubious credibility, Pounder. For the record, I still like and respect you a great deal.
Lobo, I hope that's not inside information!
for money?
/deny
esteban sucks dick for money
confirm/deny
SRSLY
Add more drama!
I'm not selling anything, Jakar. These are just my opinions.
Nobody expects the Valinor Inquisition!
I agree that the ultimate fate of an individual or organization doesn't invalidate success in the interim - Napoleon was phenomenally successful, even though Otoron ended up utterly demolishing him in the end. All the memorable villains were very successful until they lost.
But I think the observation that, in the end, they still lost is also relevant. Durms built something very successful (and bad), but at the end of the day my team won, and we did it with the people who decide what the rules are and whether they've been broken on our side. We lost many battles (and won many too) but we did win the war.
Haha Lobo, good one.
Actually he set out to execute a certain plan and got very very close to his ultimate goal. He took a big part of Europe (etc etc) by force and had great success in that for many years. So in that way he was, yes.
That is, before he failed miserably and got pwned buy the allied forces, as Durms were by Valinor.
Not saying i like either Durms or Hitler, but you understand my point, eh?
Then Norin, you're saying that Hitler and the 3rd Reich were a success! How nice!
*waits for a comment mentioning Godwin's Law*
I think you fail to see one of Etrius' points actually.
How can you not agree that Manni and Mute made Durms into a big successfull guild?
You do not have to like the guild, what it stands for or the members to admit that it was actually a success and a rather powerfull/dominant part of arda's society at that.
At least untill they got caught for what they had done law-wise and were removed.
You've been... lying in another bed? How could you! I thought we had something special!
And officially, Etrius has lost all credibility going forward. Sad. I actually liked the guy originally, but now its obvious which bed he lies in.
Cry some more.
Your mother.
What exactly are you trying to sell here, Etrius? Whatever it is, no one buying apparently.
A group of players with a grudge against making rampant rule-breaking part of your theme? Shame on us, vocal playerbase.
Think I care?
To sum up what Etrius said: we were all jealous.
There were cheaters in the guild, yes, but there have been equal or greater levels of cheating within previous guilds. I don't disagree with punishing those who break the rules, but I do disagree with removing an entire guild based on the actions of a few members. I think that decision, an unprecedented one within the history of the MUD, was precipitated as a result of intense pressure on Valinor from a vocal group of players with a grudge.
They were removed because of whining?
Gimme a fucking break, dude. I thought it was as a result of massive, wide-spread cheating and harassment.
But hey, maybe I'm just delusional.
Unless you cheat some more and keep cheating a while longer, and avoid hardbans... then they take you in and protect you and give you multiple namechanges and so and so forth? ;) ;)
Through whatever mechanics or methods, in Arda of 2010 the Durmanhoth are completely gone, without even a vestige remaining. I foresee the MUD experiencing an equal degree of success in Arda of 2015.
I didn't mean to take credit for anything... but my point stands: my guild is still here and they're not. The fact that they did stuff which induced Valinor to take unprecedented interventionist measures illustrated the root of their 'success' and presents a clear moral: Cheating benefits you in the short term and may grant you notoriety, but when the admin catches you you will be completely gone.
I'm re-reading the same comment string, and your typist made a comment sometime after mine which more or less agreed with me exactly. So 'HAHAHA' right back at ya.
The Durmanhoth were a success story, and the fact they were eventually removed only through unprecedented Valinor intervention at the behest of whiners merely serves to vindicate the point I made in that thread. Your comment makes it sound as though you personally ran them into the ground, Tireless, when history shows us that it simply wasn't the case. Considering the overall state of the MUD, and most guilds, I continue to stand by my belief that Manni's achievements were remarkable.
lulz. that comment definitely did not validate me at all
I had a nice comment, I decided to remove it. The fact is I don't play this game to make me feel better about myself. I don't pretend I'm some kind of pk god. I don't need your approval to make it worth it for me to play. I log on when I have nothing else to do. If you think being 'important' in an online text based game should be a life goal, then more power to you. Just don't pretend you were ever anything more than a gnat in someone's ear. Take a look at all your old logs and your old comments. Let me quote you. 'If log page comments didn't exist nobody would know who the fuck you are so i guess all your chars are equally unimportant.' Look what you've done on the mud. Or should I say, what you haven't done on the mud. You talked shit, much like myself. You pissed a bunch of people off, much like myself. And then you got the living shit banged out of you multiple times. Unlike myself. So, by my playbook, I'm one up on you. The difference between us? When I talk shit, I know enough to use a simple break, or not idle at rhos with no RM. I pick my enemies. When you talk shit, you piss so many people off that you accomplish nothing but your own death. You're so damn angry at the world that you decide to take your stupidity and childishness out on anyone you think you can troll. And then when your trolling works, you cry like a bitch when people do something about it. Fuck off. You're not worth my time.
you can replace douglas with one of your famous characters, but im afraid if log page comments didnt exist nobody would know who the fuck you are so i guess all your chars are equally unimportant
but hey ill hold a vote right here. dipshits of arda cast your votes. who is the better place? prince draimon or douglas king of noobness
vote 1 for draimon
vote 2 for douglas
douglas. i said be entertaining at least. not retarded
Yes!
It's just nice to look back at situations that seemed hopeless, when the enemies were so cocky and self-assured, and look at the game today: My guild is still around. Theirs is not.
Having a laugh today, are we Tireless? ;)
Also:
Date: 06. Feb, 2008, 0:10:48 By: Etrius Remove
Me too, Pallasch. I guess we'll never be as old skool as the people who supposedly started played before the books were written. Boo hoo.
I don't like a few of the people in the new Durmanhoth, and I've never been a huge fan of the whole 'ghetto' mentality, but you can't deny that Manni's got style. The new Durmanhoth is Arda's greatest, and possibly only, post-dev22 guild success story. He chose to invest in newbies, something which many of the old, stagnant elitist guilds refused to do, and it was a strategy which reaped dividends for his organization. I'd say that, overall, they're probably the best community in the game right now. Like it or lump it.
*hands out 'I love Manni' merchandise*
Behold the fate of Arda's greatest and only post-dev22 guild success story now that it's well and truly gone.
HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA.
HA.
I was just re-reading some old logs, and stumbled upon this:
Date: 05. Feb, 2008, 4:27:00 By: Manni Remove
A brief addendum:
As soon as this war with BkD has been sufficiently concluded I entirely expect that we will embark on a long period of peace. We recently had some bumps with a few guilds because of a member here and there, but I think overall our relations with just about everyone have been going swimmingly.
Manni is again proven to be prophetic. After the war with BKD was concluded, he and Durms did, indeed, embark on a long period of peace. Overall, their relations with just about everyone HAD been going swimmingly...
Except Aule and Tulkas, apparently!
HAHAHAHAHAHAAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA
Warren G and Nate Dogg :D
Gonna hit the East-Side of the LBC on a mission tryin' to find Mr. Tire-G.
~Nate
natedawg
So... you're Nate?
Speaking of nipples, I got to listen to my woman compliment Brad Pitt's man-titties in Fight Club tonight.
Fuck you all.
~Nate
Draimon has fantastic nipples Douglas. Respect.
Danny Devito has been married to Rhea Perlman for like 30 years.
I would kill myself.
It's kinda like the movie twins. One brother got the looks, the intelligence, the class. The other was Danny Devito. Guess which one you are?
You tried to kill intulor and vittorio multiple times on dreyboren douchebag. as far as mouth to ability ratio. This is kettle, how the hell are you doing pot?
i dont recall ever trying to kill you. just you being the dipshit whose mouth to ability ratio is unparalleled. if you are gonna be a loud mouth no talent newbie at least be entertaining
Sorry, Tire, I posted that last night when I was hellafied drunk...
but your name is still Nate, brotha man.
Yeah, sucks you failed so many attempts on me, cause otherwise you would have put me in my place right?
douglas is the biggest dipshit in the history of this game. and that's saying a lot
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-ILArMo0mnk
Dave's not here man
hahaha. tireless is funny as fuck when he's mad
God damnit man my name is NOT NATE.
It is DAVE. DAVE. You can call me anything you like, but NATE IS NOT MY NAME! We've been working on this for three years man, get it right!
N
to the
A
to the
T
to the test...
E
Wow. That escalated quickly. Hitlisted,warned,banned.
Sucks to be you
hahahahahaha
Nalthic has been warned/banned for posting a fake log.
It is an uh, fake log... Yeah that's it a fake log!
Nalthic. Hitlisted for crimes against Galadriel.
Only because we have proof of it now, also I can't back this up.
naked ones?
Congrats Jubal! show us pics!
Was this BkD trying to reset whip?
Nalthic stop sucking.
Your prompt is ugly.
and yeah I miss you Nalthic <3
haha Lobo. Oh by the way I won gold and bronze in the jiu-jitsu tournament :P
Haha, badass.
Personally, i'd rather take a hurricane from Tom Bombadil myself...
Galadriel touches you softly and seductively. You feel your heart burst with desire!
You leave right after that? That was so homossexual.