He keeps on talking shit, so he has to die.
Fimbu, just admit it, you love it :P
Sapphire swords are easy to get. I just fought 3 or 4 amruin all with them, and they always have sapphies to spare.
Sapphy is not pleasent when you have ?friends? like fra. They first ask a moral figure to attack you , and then your sword goes to bad condition... Then a bunch of shadowspawns attack you. Not very effective then ,is it?But then again, fra are gone...
Az, I think there are lot fewer SoM npc's than you think there are. I mean shit, last time I aligned Gothmog on the Pelennor...he was Demonic and he's Sauron's General on the field. Sure, there may be tons of them in Mordor...but they might as well not exist for all the good it would do a moral to go in just to raise his alignment. Look at Wasach, in the 3.5 yrs he's been playing he's been HoE for perhaps a combined 24 hrs of gameplay.
The npc's that hold the popular armours, shields, packs are not SoM. They are villainous (like the carapace tentacle) or demonic. I even think Tenzek is just immoral. If you ask me, it's a bit moronic for creatures to have an alignment. Unless they are supposedly 'intelligent' creatures like the watcher or the Cold Drakes (villainous also).
Let's not even forget to mention that because we are all parts of the great son, we are ALL Hand of Eru. It would be more accurate to have the highest level of moral alignment to be 'Hand of Manwe' or some such dribble.
I hope that after the ER's are release the ainur take a few days of rest (ie get sloppy drunk) and do something (read:anything constructive) to fix the problem with alignment in this game.
Wasach
ps. If sapphire swords are so BAD, just be glad that evils can wield it without any deficiencies to the swords abilities. Unlike morals who recieve all kinds of things ranging from loss of hp to unconsciousness when they wield evil weapons. Swords like the ASB and BLEM won't glow for anyone less than angelic (another stupid alignment name) but every other 'moral' weapon loses nothing when it's wielded by an evil and you can still wield the ASB and BLEM.
*stops himself from continuing the rant*
Anyways, I'm off to Missouri now. *wave*
There are lot of unbalances, healing is, uniques are, armour, packs, swords, gold :)
you can get some decent armour out of that cc quest :p
What is difficult about being evil and making gold is making that gold while keeping our alignment. There are very few HoE NPCs that you can make gold from. After you have cleaned out the Loth tree and honor guards and Cirdan/glorf, where else do you go? There are a few random single NPCs, but that is about it. You need an army for the pelargir guards, and most anything else will lower your align. On the other hand, there are huge amounts of Shadowspawn NPCs that have gold and weapons and armor.
That armor is a good point, and I have brought it up with the ainur and with Balance a number of times. There is no good armor that is held by HoE NPCs, or even a moral one. It's all held by evil people. all of it.
uh yeah, kabuto. do that. and then post a log with the title poster is stupid.
The sapphire sword has a huge 'flaw' or whatever you want to call it.
Saying it's too hard to fight people with sapphire swords is only a proof of the lack of knowledge of it imho.
Uhm. sure...
Take 4 of your friends with sapphire swords and Shelob will drop like an asian on a parking cone.
I've been reading this comment section and I think there is a very important point that you all are missing when it comes to the ease/hardship of playing a good or evil character.
The 'moral' Guilds don't force their RP on you. You can simply tell them that you do not wish to be involved in their RP and they will leave you alone. I'm not sure if the GG follow this but I know it's been done by KoDA, Amruin and VC. Eru only knows if the BkD even have to bother protecting Erebor, although I've heard of some people cleaning out the place with BkD members passing them by (and yes Rolf, I can provide you with the names of these people if you wish to verify). This whole attitude came about because of members of FRA and Durms (specificly) who's members would hunt in RP combat or use a previous RP engagement (staying in combat with the individual) to fulfill a contract or just jerk-off a free kill later on.
So the choice is basically yours, try and play to the fulfillment of the game and paricipate in the RP of all the Guilds or don't. Yes, moral guilds do place large restrictions on themselves and this is because of their RP. If you think it's easy to make gold as a moral, you are fooling yourself. It's just as hard (if not harder) then for an evil. That elven longsword quest you speak of Raqtor is usually atleast half empty because invariably someone comes along and kills the elven commander. Loth war camp has some good gold but there is a large section of the camp that you can't take solo (sounds like Linhir, eh?). The Haradrim camp is shitty gold and anyone who claims otherwise is bullshitting you. I've cleared the camp and it's not worth the time and effort of running back and forth to sell all the gear (but when your desperate, your desperate).
The moral silver flask quest? a fucking bitch and a half, period. I spoke with the ainur who coded it, shortly after I found out it was in the game and I learned the whole quest. I submitted ideas for some changes. Some of them were implemented, some of them weren't. Basically though, this is that specific ainurs take on the quest
'of course it's harder than just killing Glorfindel, it's not supposed to be easy to be moral'
As for mordor gates...yes we took a huge hit in the weaponry department when that change occurred. I like the change though, it is more thematic AND it should have rallied all the moral guilds together because now you need help to get through the gates. Sadly this hasn't happened...some people just need to pull their heads out of their asses but *shrug* that's not my problem. Sure theirs shelobs lair and if you ask me, it's to fricken easy. Anyone who is scared of shelob or dies in the lair fucked up big time. (yes I've died in the lair..becuase I fucked up and also trying to save people)
On the other hand, if shelob is such a bitch to get by, get 20 of your close guild buddies, allies, friends, whathaveyous and go kill the pussbug in the first day of the uptime. That gives you atleast 2-2.5 days of free access to mordor. Fuck, it's not a goddamned mathmatical PhD thesis people.
Whatever side you choose presents it's own bonuses and it's own detractions. Live with it.
Wasach
GOLD GOLD GOLD GOLD GOLD GOLD GOLD GOLD GOLD GOLD GOLD
MORE!
GOLD GOLD GOLD GOLD GOLD GOLD GOLD GOLD GOLD GOLD GOLD
Thanks!
of course, i forgot for a second you are an assassin by trade. I take it your fines are more than petty.
what the hell do you need gold for anyhow??? Even doing little things you can accumulate vast wealth. Besides, anything over an accumulated wealth of 50k is superfluous. Unless of course you wish to waste your time going to 21 and 22. Anyone who has been there knows how useful that is! =P
Lorien is friggin great gold, stop whining Raqtor :P
dont complain about the thieves hitting all your good stuff, because they hit all the high gold ncps that morals fight too.
the orcs in moria and the silvan longsword quest are hit just as frequently as the stuff in linhir.
Lothlorien - Good gold, great exp, moral town.
Good gold where? I can perhaps kill one or if I am lucky 2 honor guards and use half the gold on healing.
I would rater go do the Silvan longsword quest and get 1100 gold without healing.
And a honor guard gives about as many exp as an Ugly Orcminas tirith - great gold, great exp, moral town.
MT is a lovely place. But the NPC here are quite tough. even the damn citizens are kicking ass. and when you finally kill then yo ufind that their gold is allready stolen.
I would rather go kill Ugly Orc's in mirkwood where I can kill them all without getting a scratch. And their swords are not stolen.dol amroth - good gold, good exp, moral town
I agree. DA is pretty nice. NPC are still tough but killable. though I rarely get to kill more than one before 3 KoDA is over me with 3 sapphire swords.
I would rater go to Moria and lay waste to orcs who give more gold and are killable with just a sword.linhir - great gold, good exp, moral town
The gold is great. But the NPC's are too tough for me. There are no good healing eccept the healer who is always out. It is really popular for maxed warriors/wizards and gold making parties so your competition here is wast. Also thieves like this area wich of cause degrades your loot. and it protected by NAoG and KoDA. It does not clasify as easy gold.
edoras - good gold, great exp, moral town.
Edoras is quite small. It has a few popular rich NPC's who are easy to kill. Amruin patrol them often and thieves do too.
I can name atleast 5 camps with rich easy evils who are not protected by some RP faction.Don't take this af if I am complaining. Its ok to have it harder. Just don't say immorals make gold easy.
*baps tarith*
lol, go durad! ;)
(HP:230 EP:230) legend durad
Durad
Rank: Maia (male)
Last on: 9m 24s ago.
Age: 17d 9h 5m 10s
Info: I like runts and nerds. They are tasty.
No Plan.oh my fucking god
Nope Hobbe, what's that?
I have one thing to say... SS and whip.... Nirrab KICKED MY ASS WITH WHIP and i used sapphy against him. I hade 13 hp and would have died if he hadent missed the last double hit... And some have allredy sade it but i say it again. There are booth bad and good things about being moral and immoral... Date: 14. Jan, 2003, 02:24 By: Ermac 'can be used by morals if they're stupid enough (and have enough people to go through gates) or immoral thieves' You ever heard of Shelobs lair?
Such a waste of MELS on a lowbie.
Yes, but the mank deal is the same thing, ther is no bank near the war camp :)
i meant the lothlorien city not orc camp..
I make gold at Lothlorien war camp, it also has no bank near but that is not much of a problem :P
I think Raqtor meant its hard to hunt at linhir or lothlorien alone.
Lothlorien is really hard for one person , no bank in the city , Linhir is a bit hard for assassin to hunt alone after the changes in water.
heh
Actually Alorian, I usually find it quite difficult to be an utter bastard to everyone I meet. Except those who abbreviate 'you' to 'u'...
oh and ermac...plenty of hbs near haradrim camp
Shut up:p
Sapphy rules.
I'm demonic and still I don't have any problems with sapphies.I mean..if it's not mels or whip or something..just grab a sailor's cutlass or some crappy crimson, sharpen it and go solo someone.
Of course, you can bring 4 warriors to headbutt for fun:)
uhm doh, forgot..
That would be: 'That's not true Lotraz' in english.
Undskyld jeg siger det, men det var da godt nok noget af en gang lort at fyre af Lotraz :P
Let's just pretend Live didn't have a sapphire sword? :)
I think we are all forgetting the class of this log, which is that Live died.
I think you're all just crazy. There are plenty of things to kill for gold on either side, there are plenty of things to kill for experience on either side, and there are plenty of weapons to go around. Morals may have taken a hit when Mordor became largely inaccessible to them (as far as weapons go), but I agree that they still do have the advantage in terms of armour. Personally, I've always used DWS, hauberk, mail pants, and Gothmog's gauntlets for armour. I can do all of them morally, while at least two of them (three, if the Watcher is evil), can't be done immorally. Everything's got its ups and downs, people. If you can't make easy gold on either side, you're not looking hard enough. If you can't do align quests on either side, you're not looking hard enough, and if you can't find decent EQ on either side...need I say it? You're not looking hard enough. Go forge a sword if you really want an impartial weapon that kicks ass (even though disguising moral to do it is an annoyance. :P)
Friend asked me to post the following:
Places for immorals to kill:
edoras - good gold, great exp, moral town.
protected by: amruinLothlorien - Good gold, great exp, moral town.
protected by: VC (sometimes)minas tirith - great gold, great exp, moral town.
protected by: No onedol amroth - good gold, good exp, moral town
protected by: KoDA
problem: few huntbreaks nearbythranduils - decent gold, okay exp, moral town
protected by: glorglaslinhir - great gold, good exp, moral town
protected by: NAoG (sometimes)mordor - great gold, great exp, immoral place
protected by: anyone who wants a free kill
problems: no laws!
can be used by morals if they're stupid enough (and have enough people to go through gates) or immoral thievesdol guldur - bad gold, bad exp
protected by: SoUlothlorien war camp - good gold, good exp
protected by: no onepelennor fields - good gold, good exp
protected by: no one
problem: few huntbreaks nearby, tough monsterspelargir - crummy gold, crummy exp
protected by: no onetenzek's camp - okay gold, okay exp
protected by: DH
problem: deathtrapharadrim camp - good gold, good exp
problem: no huntbreaks nearby at all
raqtor, how can you have been here this long and not know tons of stuff to kill for gold as an immoral char?
and why do you need to kill the NPC to get to captive??? much easier way which involves killing an elf...
let the morals have sapphire, honestly is it that big of a problem...dont think so when most of the power weapons can really only be used by shadowspawn/demonic for thier full effect. SS, WHIP,etc..
Dmask serpents are demonic.
Date: 13. Jan, 2003, 15:50 By: Trempk Plus its a lot easier for non-morals to get gold
HUH? I would just like to know one place where I can get easy gold? I can surely name the first 20 for moral chars. So a 20 to 1 ratio would surprice me. name one ? I don't think you can eh? And if you know one I am pretty sure its always out.
Every time I need to make gold my align drops to Angelic and I have to use another week to get it back to shadowspawn.
Perhaps I am unaware of the places where evils can make gold? Though the moral ways are so easy to find. The are everywhere.
When I need to make gold the evil way I have to find a friend and make sure we both have awesome EQ .. then I can go kill in a few of the cities with my friend. If we are lucky enough to escape the RP attacks and lucky enough to find anything in.
And yes Immorals kill evil NPC's .. not because they want to but because they have no choice.
And Aloran compared to the 3 moral align quest I know who can be done by low levels and on an alias theese 2 quests are extremely hard. The captive quest is quite impossible since you have to kill a REAL tough NPC in order to get in and when you get in you always find that the quest is out. Normally I have to leave half way through killing that NPC and heal. And often someone finished him off when I gat back there.
Rhoads DDM serpents and DMP serpent is Villanious and carapace tentacle is Shadowspawn.
Got it, Lotraz.
Thanks
Borkaz, I belive you misunderstood you. When I wrote realisticly I didn't mean thematicly. I mean that the real chance of a player to do the moral version of the silver flask quest is all too close to zip and zero.
Before you have finished the god damn quest, some evil dude has killed Glorfindel. And... he gets killed very often close at spawn. which means you have to wait for him to spawn. However, before the stable boy gets to him, some other player most likely have engaged and likely killed Glorfindel.
So, realisticly seen, there is no moral version of the silver flask quest and the bloke that spent his free-time coding it, merely wasted his effort.
Thats what I meant Borkaz.
Carapace tentacle would be shadowspawn.
Otherwise it wouldn't be so easy with a sapphy.
If you are Hand of Eru the effect is also the same so I don't see a reason to complain here :)
If you're shadowspawn they lower your align, so does the rats at mail pants
If i am not mistaken, the DM serpents, the DWS spider and the carapace tentacle are impartial
btw, yeah, i do know how annoying it is to be som and have it drop everytime i log on because of getting eq. being evil though, is more than just having som alignment.
Lotraz: And don't forget, morals -realisticly- seen doesn't have access to silver flasks either. Thats really a benefit the evils can value.
Lotraz, a question: In your opinion what is more realistic? An evil one walking all the way to the Havens, where evil never came, not even during the time of the last alliance, running past all the guards there, walk into the tower and do his thing to get the staff. (not about the killing itself, cause I dont see a moral killing gothmog that easily also)----or a moral in The Havens and that Glorfindel for an effort/job gives you the flask in return?
In retrospect: It's also not likely for a moral to enter Don Guldur and live. And so on. I guess thats called playability?
Yes they are. but the torturing thingy is crappy because theifs can sneak in, so when you kill the guys who needs to die. (who can be hard to whack) and go to the quest its usualy gone, what a waste
shadowsword,torturing the captive, both fairly easy
And you have no idea how anoying it is to kill the watcher when you are shadowspawn, first you work very hard to keep your align but you dont wanto run around with a wooden shield/sword so you have to kill immorals, then go back to work as hell to get your align up, just to lose it then next time you log on
Yes i know, just had to counter Trempk's comments :P
yeah, but noticed no guild restrictions include the stuff like dws, hauberk and carapace.
Well. all decent equipment is worn or protected by evils
hauberk - watcher
carapace - tentacle
war shield - orc to get in and a spider
mmail - bunch of immorals
sturdy - kinda crappy but still
emerald shield - immorals.. i think :P
deathmask - serpentswhats left? elder's shield and some shitty breastplates in MT?
no thanks
Most immoral characters(not immoral/impartial) justify killing some immoral NPCs too, like the watcher, dmask serpents, etc. Whereas most moral characters kill no moral NPCs
i dont really how you think it's harder to play an evil char than it is moral. gold comes a lot easier for immorals. exp comes a lot easier, just go kill a few mt guards. as for the RP part of it, it takes a lot more patience and character to hold back agression and show some respect for other players than it does to run around acting like a jackass. where is the difficulty in playing an evil char? plenty of gold, plenty of exp and you run around, pretty much behaving as if no one matters but yourself
Plus its a lot easier for non-morals to get gold
Oh, just figured I'd add this.
The dude that wasted his time coding the moral version of the silver flask sure did waste his time there. Geez!
Ok, its a neat quest, very nicely done with lots of great effects and well 'coded'. But my oh my! You just forgot how much easier it is to go and kill Glorfindel and even the stable boy to ensure you get the flask as evil.
Its like, I just wasted alot of time doing this somewhat complicated quest, just to return and find Glorfindel and the stable boy dead. Bummer!
What a waste of code... just like Moria, ... or the lower levels of Shelobs lair, ... or the thief gold mine CU, ... or... ok, enough whining. Its just a waste of time by those that spend their freetime doing it. :)
Raqtor, its true that this game greatly lacks in the design of balance (read: there are none), ... however, the result has been as you mentioned the difference in skill between the two player groups.
That said, I don't see playing moral entirely as playing T2T in 'easy mode'. Mostly because the moral guilds tends to enforce lots of stupid regulations on themself.
And don't forget, morals -realisticly- seen doesn't have access to silver flasks either. Thats really a benefit the evils can value.
(No, this last line ain't flame-bait... notice the -realisticly-).So, just to sum up... let the newbies keep their sapphire swords and feel pride in your fang, ... remember, we do mostly win anyways, eh? :)
Yeah Lotraz. Perhaps you don't go around RP'ing that much.
I just hate it when I try to make some gold in DolAmroth and a lvl 14 ranger with a sapphire sword and a sturdy armour comes and beats me up.
I mean I payed ALOT of sweat and gold for my hauberk gauntlets mail pants war shield and fang. And for what? some lvl 14 with cheap eq can beat me up.The only reason the evil players can stand up to the morals is because it is so much harder to play evil in this game. Therefore the average evil player is more skilled than the average moral.
There should also be a better veriation of weapons in use by the morals. At the moment hardly anyone uses anything but sapphire swords.
Geez Raqtor... If the Sapphire Sword were that big a problem, Im sure everyone would run around being all moral by killing all those evils with it.
Its not like we, the evil players are having trouble dominating Arda already. Allow those few morals left to have their perks.
You know, live just asks the most annoying questions. and then keeps asking, and keeps asking and keeps asking... in other words. well don
I'm SoM Raqtor, and I hate sapphies too.
Whine whine whine :)
STOP WHINING!
Live slices you cleanly. << 11 damage
And thats the second weakest attack this sword has. How evil are you Ultilh?Live wreaks havoc on you with many devastating blows. << 22 damage for the 3rd best attack
I just cant get how this sword is still in the game.
i only know because i killed him too, thinking he was 19, had to pay the fine for killing lvl 12 :P
He probably shouldn't disguise his level then, huh? People who disguise up and can't play like they level they pretend to be are just asking to die easily.
he disguises his level all the time. he was no higher than 14
He was a deathmaster when I killed him, at least his legend said so.
he was like what, level 13 when you killed him?