Watch teh RoI great RP...
Deboraha isn't smart enough to argue with Otoron, so why does she bother?
love,
- Kujo
Well, the log was posted as an attack on RoI's roleplaying, so what else are we supposed to comment about? :p But it is pointless considering that nothing will result from it. I could have a point, but it looks like there's too much bullshit on both sides involved and i don't think either really wanted a real solution, else they would have went about it a different way.
Not really. Comments are meant to be just that: a comment on the log itself. Not some stupid chain of angry people arguing over why it's against theme that someone died. My point is, who cares whether it was against theme or not? That won't change that it happened. You're arguing something that's already been decided, basically. But hey, keep it up, it's entertaining :)
-Fofe
Fofester, 'get over it and move on', while a noble and mature way of looking at things, pretty much removes the whole point of the comments section of the log page.
-otoron
Call me crazy, but I really see no point in arguing over why he died, how thematic it was, or whether Barren should get a spanking for it. He died, there's nothing you can do about it. Get over it and move on.
-Fofe
I'm gonna make a guild of Minas Tirith exotic pet owners and we'll all have monkeys.
That would rock.
-otoron
All that matters is that I am in RoI, so that should speak very highly of them! *yawn*
Hahahaha, pet ravens, I remember that.
Funny memories.
D
Someone throw me a tomato!
And I am not Eowyn, contrary to popular belief.
Thank you, Zelindo.
And no matter how master-servant their relationship might appear, Deoraha and Lost are still not Frodo and Sam.
Trempk... umm, we have restrictions. I don't really understand how you can say we don't. As I -do- recall, we don't have any ainur-imposed restrictions saying we are not allowed to kill non-allies who talk shit.
Oh wait. Amruin don't have those restrictions, either. Oh, wait... Amruin have no kill restrictions on PCs at all... like every other guild in Arda.
Funny that.
-otoron
FaAnlr
Hey, guess what. Otoron isn't Faramir, everyone! Deal with it.
Omg, are you ripping it outa me? :P 2 -HUGE- comments :P
And when our horses were removed, we were pretty much given the reason that 'guilds were for RP, not NPCs that helped you kill stuff.' That and that every other guild was trying to copy the megs and amruin, as if their theme even had anything to do with having a pet, ravens, panthers, hawks, owls whatever the hell everyone else wanted. Then they took away our not as cool, but very animationable and still cool horses again because nobody else had them or something equally as dumb. Now we have generic horses that we need to pay for every boot, that have no identity or personality whatsoever. Maegril was the fucking shit (my horse) and now he's just like everyone of them. Shit, Snickers was even cooler than the horses now, and he had a really stupid name, lol. Sorry Barren, I can't lie :p
My comment wasnt to bash ainur, i would like to be an ainur myself, but wouldn't want to give up any part of my mortal life to do it, which isn't possible according to the rules. I don't have the answers, i don't know how to fix rp. And I think that everyone would enjoy RP if it could live up to its potential. In my not so humble opinion, I think that if you don't like RPing, you're just trying to play the wrong role for yourself. You for example jasumin, might be in RoI cause thats where your friends are and thats what you are, you're a part of the guild and its history and you love it and don't want to give it up. Maybe you would fit better roleplaying someone who wasn't constrained to a group of people, who knows.
They moved this towards being an RP mud?????? There isn even half as much RP or even the desire to RP here as there used to be. I took a long break from this game, so a lot of the time I'm subconciously expecting it to be what it was like 4-5 years ago...and it is totaly different. Many ways better, some ways not so good. In my opinion, but that's just my opinion. When I left, they we're gonna make ArdaV2.0. Thank your lucky stars that never got off the ground:P
Hrm..Hirgail the silvan Allied Tradesperson....got a nice ring to it;)
Quit posting such big comments... I can't be bothered to read it all :P And it's too long!
Damn you Draugluin, for ruining the game and my entire life.
You are everything that's wrong in the world!
There. I feel better.
Dear Trempk,
Thank you for putting your complaint in such a narrow focus. However, if you want to put the blame somewhere, I'd prefer instead of labeling 'the ainur' the 'real hipocrites', that you just blame me. I will be your hypocrite, the focus of the problems, and the shining light representing all that is wrong. Let me know if you need help with anything else.
D
PS: I killed your horses, but 'roleplay' wasn't a factor.
Now...the real question is...will anyone read that comment?
Or will everyone do the popular thing and quit reading once they see who it's posted by? :P
Your post makes it sound like RP is such a great and wonderful thing. The fact is that some people enjoy it, and others don't. I'd say there's a good mix of both, and I always hear people say 'well if you don't like RP, find some other MUD' That's crap. This MUD is home to people of different playing types and the diversity makes it a better place. Yes. RP is fun and great, but it is not a real world but first and foremost a game. RP is wonderful, but it should take the fun out of the game. This of course has been addressed many times. RP vs Playability. In my not so humble opinion, playability should always outweigh RP, and RP should only be added where it won't have major affects on the playability of the MUD.
As it is, you either have to 'RP' in some way or learn to fend entirely for yourself because you are not part of a group.
If you ask me, the main thing the ainur have done wrong is try too hard to move this MUD towards being an RP MUD.
Don't get me wrong, I want a high level of realism such as it was in the books, in the game, but I see the possibility (and always have) of certain groups that Tolkien never made reference to being active in Arda in those times, and I think that the number one priority of the MUD should be fun. Some of the changes that have been made to bring a higher level of roleplay to the MUD have, in my opinion, been detrimental to the fun factor of the game. That's where the problem lies.
There, you have a bit of a dissenting opinion.
Ok, i didn't want to make one long comment, so this one doesn't have anything specific to do with this situation, but is about guilds in general.
The real hipocrites are the ainur. They should have never taken away amruin horses if they don't care this much about how guilds RP. :p It seems to me that the real reason for guilds to exist is still the same. People can just as easily RP outside of a guild as inside, the only aid to RP that being in a guild gives them is a guild board to discuss their ideas. Everything else they could have outside of a guild and even then, they could just use mail as a board. The guildcomm, armoury, bars, stables, bear pits, caves, barracks, etc. all are just descriptional RP. They could be tools for those in the guild to RP more, but its too restricted to inside the guild. The more useful purpose for guilds these days is the armoury, comm(for pp communication purposes), and a perminant huntbreak and safehaven for drunk healing and idling.
Some guilds keep tighter leashes on their members than others and the ainur keep tighter leashes on some guilds more than others. But sometimes it doesn't balance out. I think that if a person in DH, or RoI, or whoever can do whatever they want and RP as an individual who can essentially do whatever they want, and still be allowed the privilege of being in a guild, then I should be given my original amruin fighting horse back because i want bonuses too.
I do admire the people in my guild, currently trying to find great new and better ways to RP riders of rohan, especially Turk. It gets you excited just reading their ideas. But they're just ideas, and in the back of my head i think that they won't work because of the way this game is, and it sucks, cause it would be really cool.
http://logs.dyndns.dk/thread.php?thread=150
The first thing that needs to be decided to settle this is whether or not Barren was justified in killing a moral elf he didn't know to get aiglos. Everything thats happened since Polk died is irrelevant because using it for justification would just be creating a problem to justify a solution, which isn't right.
Boromir might have killed frodo for the ring, men of gondor are not immune to succumbing to their desires. Then again, aiglos isn't exactly the one ring. Individuals of gondor might not hold the same ideals as the whole of gondor, they might not mind killing a few elves or negatively affecting a relationship with possible allies. But would a group such as RoI accept people of such low character? (I mean the player's character's character) Or would they not care about what kind of a person a guy was just as long as he got the job done in battle? Should the privilege of being in a guild require a person to to accept the ideals of the larger group and force him to hold to those standards in all situations. I don't think gondor as a whole would have killed someone they didn't know out of the blue for aiglos. But an individual taken from that group might have. Why do guilds have restrictions if they would act different under those situations as individuals? There are a lot of different points to look at, its pretty complicated, which is why i don't think you people are capable of settling this the way it should be settled, but anyway..
I don't admire when guilds kill people for having an opinion and voicing it, imo a better solution would be to talk to them and show them their reason for badmouthing you isn't very good, killing them doesn't change their mind, it just closes their mouth, and most of the time it doesn't even do that. I also don't see how people can completely ignore what other people have to say just because they don't like them. I mean, I don't like a lot of people, but i still take what they have to say into my thoughts. Deboraha has some good points, and just because she's a hipocrite or whatever doesn't make her points any less valid.
How can I paint red Devinius?? ;-)
TTTTTTOOOOOOMMMMMMMMMMMAAAAAAAATTTTTTTTTTTOOOOOOOOO
Yep that's me. Stupid Devinius. Paint me red and call me a tomato.
I believe we already know how stupid they are,
and now, you comments made you look stupid (at least for me).
I don't like the fact I got killed neither btw ;)
Polk I don't like the fact that you got killed, I don't think badly of you at all. My comments were for Deboraha and if you want to defend that witch, go right ahead. I find it funny you only mention me as stupid and yet say nothing about Eznima Caber or anyone else. *snicker*
Who's stupid?
I still dont got any clue who the hell barren is!
Funny how Otoron justifies his guild actions with RP when he needs to, and when they kill me it 'Had nothing to do with 'RP''...
And Devinius, you're stupid.
Hirgail while you're GM the best move you could ever hope to make, is giving your guild a chance to stand on it's own leaders, and not the influence of the forktongued wench Deboraha.
I know everyone else in Arda would dearly like to see her out of Glorglas where she can be hunted down and killed repeatedly.
I'm starting the Anti-Deboraha Coalition. Members get a free log of me scalping Deboraha twice at the Event.
And yes I know GG had their entrance changed.
Caber, Eznima, Otoron, and Durad - you all are so cool. Hey Deboraha - FUCK YOU TOO from all the Galadhrim. *smooch* My only criticism in this incident is that it wasn't Deboraha on those rocks dying.
Otoron you're right of course, at the end of the day Deboraha is just a whiner who goes running to Valinor every time she 'thinks' she can get someone warned or nuked - which I think is hilarious since the Vala I know, personally don't give a fuck about her whining.
And I find all this whining by Deboraha and other Glorglas really hypocritical - maybe someone should refresh Deboraha's mind on her contracting a certain member of the Galadhrim, and Glorglas killing him on the steps of their Guildhall just for being there.
Maybe someone should remind Deboraha and Lost and Hirgail that they have standing orders to kill anyone loitering at their GH entrance - or does that only apply to me and Undertow? Maybe me being a moral elf, I'll go stand at your guild entrance and you see if you attack me. Hell I think I'll send Undertow there and see if you attack us both.
Deboraha you're a hypocrite and a deceitful manipulative witch. You are quick to point the finger, and even quicker to ignore your own actions.
I'm off to play in bree sandbox now! HurraH!
Woh, you really read all that stuff!? Kidding ofcourse...
I'm pretty sure that's all it is about, the want for an item.
I remember certain people killing Beornings for it before to...
Nice, an outright cesspool of comments, haven't seen one of these in a while! Let me contribute by saying: I agree with Trempk's first comment. I don't think a single drop of 'RP' was involved, only the want of an item.
same stupid=some stupid, of course
Deboraha, you run to Valinor and try to get your way every single time something goes wrong. Someone makes some voodoo dolls of you and you don't like it? Do you bitch like Fimbu and Mithgil and take it in stride, or run to Valinor to have them stopped?
Your member talks shit about Armada, myself, and my guild, and dies for it. And I have Thingol breathing down my neck before Lost even -tried- to talk to me. What happens? The Powers, being slightly more intelligent than some random ainu, decide that maybe a single god shouldn't be dictating to guild's how to fulfill their theme, or even more so, their inter-guild relations.
Yes, guilds went through theme review. We have a great theme, and stick to it. We don't go rampaging around killing elves in Arda.
Players are another issue entirely. Screw you. You wanna be an asshole and cause problems, fine. Don't think the fact that you have a '(Angelic)' in your title makes any difference to me.
Are you my ally? Do you fight with me in Gondor? No. There is no real thematic reason for us to be allies. We are estranged from Elves. I am not Faramir, and Osgiliath has been fully overwhelmed and MT is under seige and you guys are at the Forbidden Pool.. .so we drive you out. We don't even kill you. Hirgail goes apeshit (probably the reason I had half of Arda laughing in approval when he died), puts a buncha people on ignore after calling them names and trashing their theme.
And as for your implications about DH and RoI having ties and that being why Fimbu and Ehtyar (oddly being two DH who have NO ties to my guild and never have, haha) made some jokes... maybe you are just still bitter about DH not being your playground and you having to move to same stupid inconsequential Elf guild to do it?
I think there is a reason even your cousins in Lothlorien hate you.
You can keep comparing yourselves to Frodo and Sam, and me to Faramir, and never realize that that situation is entirely the exception.
But anyhow, once again, you can go to hell. Leave me and my guild alone.
-otoron
Deboraha: Fuck you.
Members of my guild are free to make whatever comments they want on the log archive here. 'Daen Hecil' is not 'defending RoI.' Ehtyar was pointing out that he thinks Hirgail is wrong. And Fimbu had some nice sarcasm to add. In my humble opinion, throwing in some sort of bullshit jab at my guild at the end of your anti-RoI novella is lame. If you want to talk about having 'adult conversations' and the like, perhaps you should follow your own lead and leave the petty stuff out of your righteous posts.
Thanks.
Hehe. Where to start.
How about Deboraha: I didn't read your comment. Was too long, i'd rather not get involved in you and Otoron's love debate anyway.
Trempk: I did too. Back when I was amruin, you remember Snickers don't ya...
To Everyone: I didn't know he was glorglas at the time :P I had intended to merciful him and steal the key, but he inserted it :P
So when i walked in i wielded the spear from the quest, and he died at the same time, due to the toppling altar, giving me dblow :)
To Ergo: That guy called your father... Well your mother had a fling a few years back. I'm 'that' guy. That's who I am.
To Otoron: You like to type don't you.
To Gormoth: I didn't read yours either. Too long, too many quotes.
To Estraven: I love you.
To Shado: Whats cooler than bein cool?
Hmm I thought the reason the Ainur changed/removed certain guilds was to get rid of the 'neutral' guilds from Arda in the first place?
As far as moral guilds killing one another occasionally... um yea it should happen and is thematic as we all know the 'moral' men of Arda in Tolkien books certainly didn't always get along. It certainly should be true of evil guilds having spats once in awhile without it being 'unthematic' IMO
Chill aleady ? :p
I cannot see when the rangers of ithilien a ragged band of few folk wandering in the ithilien forest ever 'protected' the elves of Mirkwood in any of Tolkien's works. Furthermore, it seemed like the elves of Mirkwood kept the evils of Mirkwood at bay and prevented a northern attack on the poow lil gondorites :)
it was elrond's council 'men' like Boromir sought when their crazed dad with a persecution mania was revealing his mind to the enemy. But oh well :) Theme is fun as long as it doesnt obstruct playability, pk weapons and generally showing the others whose the daddy...
Deboraha, you need to die and so do the rest of the fucking Glorglas. You guys are backstabbeds and shit talkers. Thanks alot.
Love, Durad
My previous comment was aimed for my friends, whom I love and admire and I feel sorry for them to waste their lifebeat in such negative emotions.
Please chill out and keep in mind that gameability sometimes comes in conflict with Roleplay, and the books' exact words.
A gondorian killing an elf in Rivendell is not unthematic. I would rather call it with minimal probability to happen. Since no gondoreans stray that far north in times of war.
Besides it' pretty much about personal relations and EQ(in the Polk case) rather than Legolas and Faramir. Who are certain characters in a certain situation.
Gollum's life was spared indeed after visiting the secret pool. Don't you agree it was a great exception rather than normal, Deb?
Barren as a player certainly knows what elves are so do most typists and you can't always see that when you just see that in every player just by typing 'glance' or 'legend'.
What I am trying to achieve with this post is to make you guys relax and remember that the whole MUD is built on quite some paradoxes, which makes us good ground for pointless collisions.
I am positive you ain't gonna solve Arda's problems winning or losing this argument.
I don't mean anyone of you should give up. Just chill out a little.
Yeah, it was such BS that Thingol couldn't assess a huge fine to force a guild to relate to another guild in the way that he wanted.
Such BS.
The day they let Valinor control guild relations is the day I stop playing the MUD.
IE Good call Draugluin.
*fat = far :p
'Yet things might have gone fat otherwise and far worse. When you think of the great battle in Pelennor, do not forget the battles in Dale and the valour of Durin's folk. Think of what might have been. Dragon-fire and savage swords in Eriador, night in Rivendell. There might be no queen in Gondor'
'And I for the Great wood', said Legolas, 'and for the love of the Lord of White Tree'.
'My lord, you called me. I come, what does the king command?' - said Faramir
Contrast with
'I don't take crap from some poncy useless firstborn' -RoI (Faramir) to GG (Legolas)
'Fuck, man he has Aiglos, (a weapon thats going to last 3 RL days), kill it. We will see later what fucking guild he is in. We can always pull the fucking strings to suit our purpose!'
'I dont care what the crap he is aligned! He was in Henneth Annun! Kill him' 'But he is a newbie, trying to explore middle earth?' 'Fuck that crap. He has huge brass shield, damn you !'
:)
Enjoy
I'm cool
meh
resulted should be resorted and I already know that I said a lot, but it needed saying.
Where shall one start?
Right! Otoron, you brought up Thingol's letter. The least you could have done when grinding about that was be accurate. You were NOT threatened with a 100K fine for past actions. You were told, as was Lost (since you got the same letter), to paraphrase: the buck stops here. Anyone doing anything to the other now and hereafter gets an immediate fine of 100K. Thingol then set himself up as moderator to the dispute because he found your behavior to be a violation of theme.
Alas, politics being what they are, Draugluin stepped in and now Thingol has resigned, but that's Valinor's bs.
Continuing...
Lost talked to Thingol when adult conversation with you got to be too much for you to handle and you resulted to threats and violence. When feeling small, just wave your sword around and show everyone what a man you are. Lost wanted guidance from Thingol because *someone* in the game has to maintain a standard of roleplay. You, obviously, are not capable.
As for you attacking elves who enter Ithillien, since your defense was that the Rimmies of Ithillien can't tell highly moral elves from orc spies of Sauron- I think Lost pointed out to you, Faramir not only didn't kill suspected spies of Sauron but he released them generally unharmed- including Gollum who was about as evil as they come AND had been to the forbidden pool. I guess you know better than Faramir?
So what is the excuse for attacking highly moral elves, who have never bothered entering Ithillien, in Rivendell, Lothlorien and Moria? It's a shame that someone who so prides himself on the munitae of Tolkien trivia gives such a fucked up interpretation to theme. (Durad, here's you cue to giggle again since I cursed again)
It's a further shame to see that this is what comes from the RoI since there are some truly good and nice players there who don't behave as though they are in a perpetual sulk.
Btw, I find it ironic that Daen Hecil are defending RoI here, then again, maybe not when one considers the close, very personal association between those guilds, funny that.
This looks very much like when RoI kills people for questing the Huge Brass Shield _belonging to the first one who quests it_. So whatever RoI says in this comment sections looks like utter bullshit.
asgsad uuuu ! There's my view on the subject!
And as for not helping you...we often killed Orcs and etc around Gondor..what do you think they were doing in Ithillien in the first place? No member went into Henneth Annun.
Otoron, you forgot to insert quote!
Don't attack someone at Aiglos if it's going to make them die because it's a hp-loosing quest. Merciful when he's out of there.
Thank you Otoron, Just what I wanted to see from you:)
It was Barren who killed me. He was guilty a murder. And rocks can't dominate me with might of Aiglos...
Funny.
Nroeb talking about us killing Elf PLAYERS as being non-RP, and the very next time I log on he's killing the Council.
But... that's somehow better RP.
-otoron
Hirgail was killed for being a whiney, annoying bastard who shot his mouth one time too many.
Had nothing to do with 'RP', except that I don't take crap from some poncy useless firstborn.
Hirgail had one of his members try to avenge his death. That member failed, and another GG died.
Then Lost died for running to Thingol and crying and moaning and getting an OL to try to impose 100k fines on my guild for killing another player from a NON-aligned guild which violates the sanctity of our secret refuges. So Lost, for acting like the male version of Deboraha (funny that), got killed.
Polk died on accident. If you look, it was the rocks that killed him, not the member I had who was busy re-wielding a new weapon with merciful on.
Still.. who cares? What have the 'MORAL elves of Mirkwood' done to help Gondor or the Rangers during the last HUNDRED years Ithilien has been occupied? Not friends. Not even allies. Useless cowards who hide behind the protection we offer, piss us off, and whine to Valinor when they get what they deserve for talking shit.
Meh.
-otoron
I dont have it Hirgail, do you?
so... who is Barren?
Nice to see 'moral' guilds at each other's throats. While outright war is somewhat over the top, a high degree of tension and occasional hostility is very much thematic between the free races!
Show the log of the conversation. (No need to point out the typo in my last tell). The one with both Armada and Otoron.
Hirgail died for badmouthing Otoron and RoI's theme.
I was not seen at Henneth Annun. That is an outright lie and is not the reason for my death.
Well, when it comes from one of the more prestiged members, I guess I'll just have to trust him :)
You were told a lie then Hobson.
as far as I've been told, Hirgail was found in HA, which as everyone knows is punishable by death. that death was justified, for it is that which their RP is based upon, the defense of Ithilien, among other things. Lost was killed because he complained to the ainu about it, and as for Polk... uh Barren's just a greedy bastard :P
I think Hirgail's comment illustrates perfectly how logic and a sense of perspective are now dead and buried in this game. Depressing. But hey, who gives a fuck right?
I think Fimbu's comment illustrates perfactly how theme and any sense of Role-Play are now dead and burried in this game. Depressing. But hey, who gives a fuck right?
Yes, yes, how could RoI possibly justify killing a Glorglas! For the Glorglas are known for being one of the most powerful aids to RoI's cause! Psha. I am sure that Sauron, like the rest of us, doesn't give a flying fuck about Glorglas.
So RoI will kill people because they have 'thier' aiglos or 'thier' huge brass shield. Riiiight..
Dunno what you guys bitching about, those guys are supposed to be ruthless. They are not morals per say, and I do not see any harm in some action on Aigolas, FINALLY that is:p
This is just another in a series of aggressive actions by RoI against the MORAL Elves of Mirkwood. Sauron loves them to be sure. Shameful. There is no other word for it.
Kabuto, no offence, but FUCK OFF
I wonder with which quote will Otoron judge RoI attacking moral elf in Rivendell...
That was disgusting, you ought to be ashamed of yourselves!
Hey Trempk, read the log before you comment? It's quite obvious that a Glorglas got killed by a RoI solely because GG got Aiglos claim. And RoI wanted it.
They killed Hirgail and Lost as well. Sucks.
Except, Kabuto, that this is not the only incident.
no offense
no offence
How's that shit smell, guys?
You can hardly judge a guild by an individual member's actions. I hardly think this is reflective of RoI RP.
Of course, seeing the way these two run about the comments section with their tails between their legs, maybe Barren just doesn't fear any repurcussions.
No offence, but kill a glorglas. UGH. RoI must be out of their mind.
What did it have to do with RP? Maybe he didnt want you stealing his guild blade. And its not like he's ever RPed in the past, no offense to barren. :p