LAME!!!!!
Also, the fire-bombings of Tokyo killed well over twice the people that died from the a bomb
Yes, it cracks me up when I hear women angered by the US overthrowing the Taliban and Iraqi govenrment. Esp under the Taliban regime, Afghanistan women were killed by the government troops for not properly covering their faces.
As for the UN, its not the US's fault its policies have made it as impotent as we wish Trempk's dad was...
Always learning from you, thanks Mithgil!
Unless I said that all Taudreks are idiots. That would be true.
All generalisations are false.
Remember that.
>The Japanese refused to surrender during WWII and it was estimated
>to take several hundred thousand American lives and cost the
>Japanese over a million lives. What choice would you have made?
>Go to college and quit reading pop-journalism.
The Japenese were looking to surrender before the bomb was dropped and the US government knew it. Let me give a few quotes.
Admiral Leahy, Truman's chief of staff: 'It is my opinion that the use of this barbarous weapon at Hiroshima and Nagasaki was of no material assistance in our war against Japan. The Japanese were already defeated and ready to surrender because of the effective sea blockade and the successful bombing with conventional weapons.'
Eisenhower, describing his reaction to learning that the bomb would be used: 'During his recitation of the relevant facts, I had been conscious of a feeling of depression, and so I voiced to him my grave misgivings, first on the basis of my belief that Japan was already defeated and that dropping the bomb was completely unnecessary, and secondly because I thought that our country should avoid shocking world opinion by the use of a weapon whose employment was, I thought, no longer mandatory as a measure to save American lives.'
When did you go to college, Squibb? During the Cold War?
Ok, Im trying not to give Mo here, but ALL my charas are in jail coz I repeated Mithgils comm!!!!
I think some of the meta information for here should be changed to:
echo '<META NAME=\'RESOURCE-TYPE\' CONTENT=\'DOCUMENT\'>\n';
echo '<META NAME=\'DISTRIBUTION\' CONTENT=\'GLOBAL\'>\n';
echo '<META NAME=\'KEYWORDS\' CONTENT=\'mud, two towers, logs, the two towers, t2t, whining, bitching, moaning, religious, germans, russians, iraq, politics, griping, Mithgil, whining, player killing, lame logs, fuck, suck, fucked, fucking, politics\'>\n';
Oh and no, Tilion isn't American
Ah well! I try to be polite but sometimes I loose my temper...
I'm Beavis Kujo? *likes it!*
I like how Deb didn't actually argue against any of Beavis' points.
Betus, even Trempk wouldn't by offended by that post.
My apologies if my post looks 'harsh', it's the way I have to discuss, I'm sorry... hope nobody feels hurt!
Came'on Deb, what about refugees from other countries in all conflicts arround the world? what about palestinian refugees camps?
Those don't put Israel vs. Palestine conflict in prespective..
I agree something HAD to be done with Iraq regime (as with all totalitarism regimes arround the world) but we all know it wasn't the REASON (or POURPOSE) of this war.
The UN is not a 'independent' organism, it's the UNION of all countries, one member failing (one POWERFUL member) and all the structure fails, wich is the most powerful member?
I have spent the better portion of the past 2 years in classes with other immigrants. A goodly portion of the refugees in the classes are from, surprise, Iraq.
The horror stories that I have heard from dozens of kurdish and native iraqi refugees are enough to break a heart many times over.
They put the war in Iraq into perspective for me.
I do not view the American military as an Alexander of the Modern Age, nor do I see it as the 21st century's Rome. Those are charming snippets of rhetoric used to inflame and outrage.
As for the USA causing the UN to fail, the UN did not need the US to make it into a paper tiger. The history of UN actions (and inactions) and decisions for the past 20 years demonstrates that they did that quite well on their own.
As long as USA doesn't come bomb my country, or I get silenced too, I'm pretty much satisfied. Hah.
Ah! I FULLY agree with you...
Silmaril : Wow! go post in T2T reality lounge forums! xD
If you read what people like Melkor or Redjack post in there...
Americans have had the habit of routinely digging their graves. Who beefed Iraq up in the first place? Just because they wanted to have an upper hand against Iran, US pumped money into the same Saddam they are now hunting. They poured money into Pakistan because they thought India is with Russia. Same with Afghanistan. The US has used nations and people over and over again, leading the same whelps to grow up into wolves that bite in their ass. That is why American world politics is so hated. They have reduced the UN to a joke. As one of my professor says, the Americans have become like the Roman empire, and the pro-war freaks all think they are Alexander the great, who can go and squash nations into nothingness.... Put things in perspective before you support wars.
Why americans are hated arround the World? Prepotence
(yes! not ALL americans are the same, but seems the ones that not agree with their goverment do nothing or can't do anything to stop it!)
The Japanese didnt have much to fight back at that time Squibb, truth is, you guys needed/wanted to drop that bomb. Thats all I have to say and Marvin, dont refer to yourself as a 'Manager'. You are not one here and some dumb people might actually believe it! :)
Trempk, your the ignorant one.
The Japanese refused to surrender during WWII and it was estimated to take several hundred thousand American lives and cost the Japanese over a million lives. What choice would you have made?
Go to college and quit reading pop-journalism.
Um, Tilion isn't American?
...Mom? What are you doing on this page? And why do you sound like Mithgil? ...Go start dinner, it's getting late, and I haven't had any yet today.
Please note:
The issue of real life politics came up not because of any possible similarities between the MUD administration and real life politics, but because of the fact that I was talking about politics at the time I was silenced.
Thank you,
Your mother
Please refer, once again, to the following statement of incongruence:
THE MUD != THE REAL WORLD
Thank you,
Management
Think of Hiroshima and Nagasaki and tell me that we were any better then than al qaeda was during 9-11. And we killed over 50x the number of innocent people. And then tell me that if it were the same today that our country would hesitate to drop them again. Just because they aren't a country makes them terrorists? We're just lucky(or the rest of the world unlucky) that the countries we piss on aren't strong enough to fight back.
You name reminds me too much of the word queef
Leave it to Squibb to come bursting in to personify the completely ignorant. I'm not even going to point it out because he's obviously a complete moron waiting to jump as high as his masters tell him to.
*whew* i feel much better, thanks for letting me respond to this bullshit misinformation *whew*
Listen you tree-hugging fucks who bend over and spread your ass cheeks for anyone who threatens you with terrorism, go suck off Al Qeda if that is how you live your life.
Saritalr wrote:
And idiots like Tilion are just letting the country become the fourth fucking reich waddling around thinking we're so couragious for fucking up other countries without them asking us to.
Just because some of them dont know about it doesnt mean all of them dont know about it. Broad generalizations = bad and ignorant.
Fourth Reich = complete fucking idiot who will die now
TO ALL CURRENTLY EXISTING CHARACTERS (PLAYERS/AINUR) OF T2T:
This is a breakthrough! I almost had a Matrix-like breakdown at first, but it is very important for you to read and re-read the following sentence, while trying to comprehend:
THE GOINGS-ON OF THIS MUD ARE NOT COMPARABLE TO RL WAR, POLITICAL, OR NATIONALISTIC AFFAIRS.
While I'm standing on my soap box, I have a few points I'd like to make. And for those of you who hate me - there are a number - maybe you'll get a chuckle out of these.
1) Those in power of this mud were entrusted with it for a specific purpose. THE OWNERS of the mud itself and ITS CREATORS (important concepts) gave DRAUGLUIN (eventually, through the trickle-down effect) the power to run the mud. Guess what - when you have the shutdown and nuke commands, there's not much else you can get. If D was so incredibly out of line and unjust - not that justice matters, it's not your mud, so it doesn't matter what you have to say, except for the fact that they extend to you the privelege of voicing your opinion; or, rather, they are courteous enough to listen - then he would not be PoL, User, Systems, and whatever else codes. Don't get me wrong - ainur are bastards sometimes, just like all of the rest of us. And guess what, I'm king bastard, so I understand a little part of everyone!
2) The ainur - those currently working on the mud - are not 'servants to mortals'. They do not 'cater to your mortal coding desires', nor are they in any way subservient to you. In fact, if it wasn't for a general professional outlook (inherent in being an ainur, 'unspoken' requirement by those above, if you will), they could bluntly tell you to shove off every time you looked at them. I think everyone here vastly overlooks the fact that we are all guests at this place. There are no superfluous rights that we have, whether assumed by our relative excess in the ability to whine or by the fact that we can give feedback at all.
Ultimately, it doesn't matter whether or not the ainur are 'abusing power' or are dickheads, or whatever you want to call them. If you don't like it, stop playing.
Gloar, you forgot to add that you played the game, possibly one of the greatest contributions one can make.
Hey Tilion,
I have contributed to this mud. Typo reports, bug reports, coding areas and such. So stfu.
Heh, you people should look at this whole thread from a neutral point of view...it doesn't matter...at all...
The vast majority then
*hugs Mithgil*
Regardless of the situation i'm glad my friend can speak again.
Trempk:
Anyway, I also get really annoyed by people(apparantly like Tilion) who like to shut people up and stay ignorant because it suits them, having no care how it effects other people. This is why everyone in the US is still ignorant even about what just recently happend in haiti, its why most americans don't know what we did in nicaragua and countless other places. The last time the US was invaded by another country was what, 1812? Since then we've invaded about 50 different countries over 200 times. And idiots like Tilion are just letting the country become the fourth fucking reich waddling around thinking we're so couragious for fucking up other countries without them asking us to.
Just because some of them dont know about it doesnt mean all of them dont know about it. Broad generalizations = bad and ignorant.
And you remind me of pepperment patty, now go eat marcy out.
all this crap reminds me of the teacher from charlie brown =\
Wanna kill me Pounder?
Do it, everyone else has had a go!
I'm not gonna comment anything coz, I can't be bothered reading the comments, too L...O...N...G for my little brain. I just can't handle such things.
Every ainur that I've seen make mistakes when it has come to punishing players has never admitted their mistake or personally taken action to correct it, they've always left it up to others to correct those mistakes for them, so they don't have to admit being wrong. Maybe I just don't see the times that this doesn't happen, maybe those aren't as publicly displayed, but it doesn't matter. And most of us do appreciate their work, but that doesn't mean we should be forced to be different people, or think/act the way they want us to. It doesn't/shouldn't give them control over us in that regard. The point is that ainur shouldn't use their powers to enforce their own agendas but only to enforce the rules of the game. And I'm sure we're all sorry for caring about things that happen IRL more than we do about making new ideas or exploring on the game.
Why does he make up shit?...saying i whine to ainur when i die.
I DO NOT!!!
Man beyaz, I almost want to kill you now, you sound so stupid. Maybe some people dislike Draugluin, but as said before, if the PoL's were really that bad you wouldn't be whining, you would be on another game somewhere else. Ainur aren't flawless, they make mistakes occasionally and most of the old players have seen cases where they have, but in general they try hard to fix code and monitor the comms from behavior that can damage the experience of players as a whole. And my fucking god, he got fucking silenced NOT nuked, he grovels for a day or two whoopie? Freedom of speech? That was inserted by idiots who don't know half the god damn story so it has no relationship to this current 'problem'. I would have to say the ainur are much MUCH better than they have been at times in the past. If you people spent say 10% of the time idea'ing cool shit ainur can put into the game instead of bashing them and posting on gay ass shit like this maybe you would notice cool shit being put into the game, but then again maybe you are all a bunch of stupid followers who jump on the bashing wagon whenever given the chance? Damn it just frustrates me to see so many intelligent people act so stupid and isntead of forming a useful cause or group start just being negative for negative sakes. Get a life.
And mithgil coming to a close of his argument? HAHAHAHA, what kind of fucking crack are you on? The only time he will come to a close of an argument and stop comming is when he types 'sleep' or 'quit' or closes his mud client. HAHAHAHA, damn whoever said that, it made me laugh on the ground for almost 2 minutes.
And think before yuo make 'baseless' accusations, Draugluin.
Thank you!
You can stick your immortalilty up your arse!
I never once whined about harrassment....I AM OFFENDED!!!!
I'm back. Good show everyone.
I'm sick of hearing about the ainur and them doing so much for us, as if they're there just so they can have the pleasure to serve us mortals. If you don't fucking like it, don't be an ainur. If you don't like to hear us bitch and moan, then ignore us and don't get involved.
And Caber's right about the forums, they're just too complicated and not accessable enough for comfortable conversation.
Anyway, I also get really annoyed by people(apparantly like Tilion) who like to shut people up and stay ignorant because it suits them, having no care how it effects other people. This is why everyone in the US is still ignorant even about what just recently happend in haiti, its why most americans don't know what we did in nicaragua and countless other places. The last time the US was invaded by another country was what, 1812? Since then we've invaded about 50 different countries over 200 times. And idiots like Tilion are just letting the country become the fourth fucking reich waddling around thinking we're so couragious for fucking up other countries without them asking us to.
And ok, unless I get any direct replies I'm done with this subject; I have nothing more to say.
Damn, like 5 comments since when I started my post. wlemme read.
I was silenced for A)pushing the Mithgil issue and B) slightly whining about it. I also had a point in what I wanted to say, but I whined and was kind of hateful too much, and I lost my point. My biggest thing was, why was he silenced for something so insignificant? Until after I was silenced myself, I did not know he was given a verbal warning saying to stop and he did not. I do, though, think it was and still is lame for someone in Valinor to say 'Stop now' when you're coming up to the end of your point, the part that really has to be said - and silencing you for it. All it shows to me is 'I'm going to show how big and bad I am by making you stand down for what you believe in' or whatever. I guess. My main thing is I think Mithgil, when he was not breaking ANY comm_policies, was unjustly silenced when there are others who I can name right offhand to violate the comm policies A) whenever they get on or B) just whenever they can. And what is the comm supposed to be used for, if not discussion of RL things? I mean, silencing Mithgil for talking about an interview about the war means one of two things: You want the comm to be totally in game or you were deeply offended by what he was saying, although it is the true, which could (and I'm not going to assume it would) mean you're a pro war freak. And I'm sorry for making that assumption, it's as far as I'll go with that. I'm honestly going to put my money that the main reason was because it was too RL. So let's make the comm totally thematic? We can have moral guilds spamming with salutes and evil guilds spamming/flaming the moral guilds with spits, threats, and taunts.
The forum just feels too complicated for me! I don't know, I just have a hard time routinely using it.
</Gyro's Opinion>
And for the record, I was not pasting the Iraq information, I was writing it myself.
I REALLY don't think 90% of the Ainu do it cause they are 'powertripping' they do it because someone, somewhere deserves it. I do understand that that lonesome 10% ARE in fact using their powers in the wrong way and are hipocritical about some things.. But that's life. The Powers have good judgement, if they didn't things on the MUD would be ALOT different, but if they judged some player and gave them a promotion to immortal they did it for a reason. If that person does something wrong as an Ainu, they would be dealt with, but your petty wimpering about the small stuff is getting pretty lame. Being an Ainu isn't all the fun and games it may seem to be, on top of coding a game so that you people can have a place to come after work/school just to have fun, they have to hear you bitch and moan. So just stop and think for a minute before you decide to take your anger out on the people who don't deserve it and ask yourself if you deserved it or not.
Anselmo reads Mithgil's post, sees the word fuck, and promptly melts into a quivering mass of jelly.
The forums exists for issues like this. Please keep this off the log page as we are here to read funny logs, not people discussing stupid issues like this.
Thanks
Draugluin, Lord of the Text, has spoken! All you mortal dogs bow down before him! Shame on those who use such evil curse words! They are terrible! TERRIBLE!
If I've told 'half the story', all I've left out are the mails I sent to Tilion afterward. They were all of two mails, which were obviously meant to be humorous. Tilion found one humorous enough that the posted it on the comm. And guess what? Nobody told me that was why I was silenced indefinitely until Carcharoth mentioned something about it yesterday. The only justification Tilion *ever* gave was that 'nobody was listening' to me. If nobody was listening, why the fuck did it matter at all?
All I really am reading is:
Blah Blah Blit Blah, Bla-Blah blah I am whining blah bli-bli-blit blah blah pig blah blit bloot blah blah blah fucker blah fuck blah blah blah.
Get over yourselves.
Draugluin: you're right, I don't know what happened on the actual game when Mithgil was silenced. Read over the history of the DA towncomm yesterday. Someone asked for my opinion, and I said I couldn't really judge without seeing the context things happened in (ie, what Tilion said to Mithgil leading up to the event, etc). BUT! I've really only gotten involved with this one in two places, and neither of them required much knowledge of the Tilion/Mithgil situation. They are:
(1) When 'Someone' silenced Zelindo for pushing the Mithgil issue with him on the comm, and then 'Someone' continued talking about it. I asked Someone to drop the issue if he was going to silence people who were responding to him.
(2) I made replies to Tilion's comments here. They were aimed more at what he's said on the log archive than what he did on T2T (for example, 'you think you can get away with saying whatever you want here?' and 'the more of you who rant, whine, bitch, etc, the more right I feel').
Now I can see him being silenced for not following the orders of an ainur. But, what I don't understand is the validity of those orders, and whether it was so important that people not be forced(wait, they can ignore him, can't they?) to hear what Mithgil was saying.
Well, the story as I understand it is this:
Mithgil was comming a sort of interview or something such on the comm for some reason that isnt important. Tilion seeing this told Mithgil to stop, either because he didn't like what was being said, or because it breached some comm policy(maybe you can clear up which it was, Draugluin). Next, Mithgil told Tilion he was almost finished with it and would speedily end it. Then Tilion told him to stop again and Mithgil didn't and was silenced.
Maybe you can tell us what really happened.
I'll address this because I feel like it, not because (based on your actions) any of you really deserve a response.
Caber - While you're generally a man of good character, too often you take up a crusade based on half the story, or sometimes, completely inaccurate information. You don't know what happened, you know what those who want you to listen to, believe in, and stand by their complaints want you to hear. Keep this in mind.
Mithgil - I'll contact you in game. Your silence was well-earned, and completely fair. Your desire to slander Tilion and tell half the story is your own issue, but it will not help you with me at all. It seems you feel public pressure, which near-instantly devolves into name-calling against Tilion will somehow help you, or shed light, or...I don't even know. It doesn't, hasn't, won't. You'd have done better to take the 30 minute silence you agreed was fair and not antagonize after that. You and I both know what happened, and coming here to the log site to alter history doesn't work. It is my stance to keep punishments private between myself and the person punished, but I will not allow you to use my expected silence as a way of altering history or attempting to begin a crusade of insanity against someone undeserving.
Beyaz - I don't think you have a clue. Really, about anything. You don't know what happened, I'm not even sure you bothered to consider anything beyond 'Here is my chance to throw stones'. Well, Beyaz, someone in your position should not toss such baseless accusations. Someone who wants 'so badly' to immort would do well not to toss out baseless generalized accusations as you have. Someone who attempts to kill himself over and over again, only to later whine that he has been harassed, in a pathetic attempt to get his enemies deleted should not speak ill of anyone else, in my opinion. While I'm sure Trempk will read this and trumpet it as my failure to be neutral, so be it: Beyaz - Go away.
To the rest of you who are unable to add anything greater to this logsite (and ultimately, Arda) than the occassional profane nickname in the hopes that by blindly piling on you will feel better - I pity you, but am glad I don't know you.
D
I simply fail to believe that someone was silenced because of pasting an interview on the main comm ? Is there some part of the story that is not revealed? *Urges people to restore his faith in justice and freedom of speech*
Also, Beyaz. Restrictions concerning free speech are not necessarily (maybe it's spelled this way.. hmm) a trait of fascist systems, but generally, all totalitarian ones (including communism, fanatic religious systems.. and so on and so on..).
From the last section:
'The more namecalling, cursing, the more justified I feel, yes.' -Tilion
So what you are saying is that you base your own opinions on whether people are right or wrong on their speech patterns and the way that they conduct themselves? If so, thats like really screwed up. 2+2= fucking 4. But I'm wrong because i used the word fuck?
Let's all rate it a 6, so it stays forever in the Top 20!
Well done then, easily your best log yet. :p
Thanks Trempk...it took me all of erm...5 seconds to create :P
Trempk-
People call me fucker all the fucking time and I get to laugh at them, it makes my day better! FUCKER
Tilion-
No I shouldn't.
Caber-
The name calling and cursing is because this game is played by people who are often times immature and angry. Their way of expressing their anger may not be the nicest, but the point is still that they are dissatisfied with you, and seeking justification in the way they choose to convey that (namecallling, swearing), while ignoring the actual point that they're upset with you, is silly.
And as for immunity on the log site...there's a difference between 'being allowed to do and say whatever they want' and being allowed to call someone a fucker. Aside from the fact that it's generally considered poor form ('flaming'), it's still free speech. You're not Emperor Tilion, and instead of wanting to punish everyone who calls you a mean name, maybe you should sit back and reflect on why they're angry.
No lets not, Aravor. Lets continue it on this thread! Whee!
Considering it all has to do with this fine log of beyaz' now anyway it is perfectly fine to continue:
The last two comments from the previous thread:
Well.. it's not the first and not the last case that shows that the ability to code and put a lot of hard work and time doesn't nessecarily (or whatever it is spelled) come with high moral standards, self-awareness, or even maturity. Is there anything we could do about it? Hmm.. No. So let's live on, stop wasting our time, emotions and health over something we can't change and enjoy this funny game happily altogether ever after! (Or, as in my case, let's get to work on the thesis at last!).
Damn Ainur think they are Adolf, or some other fascist pig!!!
Get over yourself Tilion, you're in a postition of power and have clearly gone too far with it.